Crunching the numbers

Point out news stories, on the net or in mainstream media, related to polywell fusion.

Moderators: tonybarry, MSimon

Post Reply
Joseph Chikva
Posts: 2039
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:30 am

Post by Joseph Chikva »

paperburn1 wrote:
Joseph Chikva wrote:As far as I know US today is not an exporter of weapons to my country. Weapon for free?
Sorry Joesph before 2008 we sold some to you guys and in 2013 Section 1242 calls on the Secretaries of Defense and State to develop a plan within 90 days "for the normalization of United States defense cooperation with the Republic of Georgia, including the sale of defensive arms". It encourages NATO member and candidate countries "to restore and enhance their sales of defensive articles and services to the Republic of Georgia as part of a broader NATO effort to deepen its defense relationship and cooperation with the Republic of Georgia".
That's one reason Puten is pissed at us....I do not know if the arms will resume with you guys but after supporting us so well in afghan war we just might.
http://www.worldpoliticsreview.com/arti ... si-smiling
Thanks, I did not know.
But in reality I've seen only some quantity of M4 rifles and "Harris" communication radio. And our soldiers had a trouble to use Harris.

Joseph Chikva
Posts: 2039
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:30 am

Post by Joseph Chikva »

ladajo wrote:They know it is silly to even try for parity.
I think that they have another strategy. To win economically. And they are really winning.

In my youth when I was living in SU I've heard Chinese parable how from top of the mountain smart monkey observed how tiger (e.g. US) and lion (e.g. SU or on contrary) tore each other.
And what we can see today? There is no more SU, while US has big finance problems.

ladajo
Posts: 6267
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 11:18 pm
Location: North East Coast

Post by ladajo »

It is apparent that you attribute a level of stability and control to the Chinese that they themselves do not seem to agree with.
That is a worried government.
You seem to want to put them on a pedestal and grant them king of the world status. They are a long way from that. A very long way.
The development of atomic power, though it could confer unimaginable blessings on mankind, is something that is dreaded by the owners of coal mines and oil wells. (Hazlitt)
What I want to do is to look up C. . . . I call him the Forgotten Man. (Sumner)

Joseph Chikva
Posts: 2039
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:30 am

Post by Joseph Chikva »

ladajo wrote:You seem to want to put them on a pedestal and grant them king of the world status.
I want nothing. As China is not my country and I am not their fan at all. But all said by me was only the ascertaining of lying at the surface and well visible facts.

ladajo
Posts: 6267
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 11:18 pm
Location: North East Coast

Post by ladajo »

Have you considered that those "facts" may not be "facts" but misrepresentations by folks with agendas?

Did you know (fact) that the chinese government has increased its internal police budgets to control the populace more than what it has done for it's military build-up?

What does that tell you?
The development of atomic power, though it could confer unimaginable blessings on mankind, is something that is dreaded by the owners of coal mines and oil wells. (Hazlitt)
What I want to do is to look up C. . . . I call him the Forgotten Man. (Sumner)

Joseph Chikva
Posts: 2039
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:30 am

Post by Joseph Chikva »

ladajo wrote:Have you considered that those "facts" may not be "facts" but misrepresentations by folks with agendas?
Those are real facts without quotes.
ladajo wrote:Did you know (fact) that the chinese government has increased its internal police budgets to control the populace more than what it has done for it's military build-up?
No, I did not.

ladajo
Posts: 6267
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 11:18 pm
Location: North East Coast

Post by ladajo »

Maybe your facts are not actually facts.

So what do you think of the Chinese Police Buildup?
The development of atomic power, though it could confer unimaginable blessings on mankind, is something that is dreaded by the owners of coal mines and oil wells. (Hazlitt)
What I want to do is to look up C. . . . I call him the Forgotten Man. (Sumner)

Joseph Chikva
Posts: 2039
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:30 am

Post by Joseph Chikva »

ladajo wrote:Maybe your facts are not actually facts.

So what do you think of the Chinese Police Buildup?
Not actually facts?
What was China GDP (second economics) in 2011? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... _(nominal) Answer is 7,181,000 millions of USD.
What was USA GDP (first economics) that time? Answer is 14,991,300 millions of USD.

Now annual growth rate http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... test_year) is about 8-9% for China while only 1.7-3% for USA http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GDP.MKTP.KD.ZG

These are quite objective indicators not allowing any interpretations.

Now keeping the same trends:
China’s Gross Domestic Product (GDP) is expected to surpass that of the United States as early as 2016. This projection emerged as part of a new study done by the Organization for Economic Development and Cooperation (OECD).
Will they become "kings of the world" or will not - is very secondary and is only name issue.
But in reality they will have #1 economics in 2016 plus/minus several years.
Also they have fast development reserve - namely Domestic Consumption per Capita is very low for China and so market is quickly growing and extremely capacious. That is the way for further growing.
That is fact too.

Unfortunately I have no idea about Chinese police build-up policy. Is that so interesting? Is that parameter so objective as World Bank's data? I doubt.

ladajo
Posts: 6267
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 11:18 pm
Location: North East Coast

Post by ladajo »

Oh dear, Joseph.

By your own posted numbers can you not apply simple math or critical thinking?

According to you:

"CHINA GDP 2011 (In Millions): $7,181,000 "
"USA 2011 GDP (Millions): $14,991300"

Assume high end China Growth Rate: 9% (Your numbers)
Assume low end USA Growth Rate: 1.7% (Your numbers)
If nothing else changes:

Best case China GDP surpasses USA GDP: Year 2022

China GDP 2022 (Millions): $18,530,042
USA GDP 2022 (Millions): $18,045,535

So it would take at least Ten Years, under best conditions per your posting before China GDP can Surpass USA GDP.

So how does this other quote you offer fit that?
Now keeping the same trends:
China’s Gross Domestic Product (GDP) is expected to surpass that of the United States as early as 2016. This projection emerged as part of a new study done by the Organization for Economic Development and Cooperation (OECD).
Do you not understand how much political agendas influence the accurasy of statements such as the above?

Another point to consider is the physical capacity and infrastructure required to support high growth rates such as 9%. Do you anything about economic theory? The Chinese government does, and they are worried about their ability to prevent a meltdown.

They are also VERY worried about their ability to prevent a social and cultural meltdown, that is strongly influenced by economic growth.

This is why they are spending ridiculous amounts of money on internal policing, surpassing the military buildup.

They know they are riding a dragon they do not really control. And they think they are heading for a crash. The answer (they think, culturally based imperative), is to seek tighter control of the dragon, while the dragon is seeking further freedom. This is an eventual bomb that will explode, if they do not change methodology (which is culturally very hard for them).

Do you think they can last another 10 years? Do you think there could be a 'Chinese Spring' by then? or even a partial 'spring', like in the western provinces. We will see. Maybe, maybe not.

China is not 10 feet tall. They are in fact shorter than most realize. They just happen to be the most noticed kid on the block, for a lot of myth based reasons that are being sustained, and sometimes grown via a circular re-enforcement mechanism.

You do not know China. You simply repeat wrote silliness blindly, and do not even stop to think about what you are saying and if it should be questioned or how. Kind of like what you do with fusion discussions sometimes.

Yes, what the Chinese spend on internal security is important. Especially when compared to spending for External Security.
The development of atomic power, though it could confer unimaginable blessings on mankind, is something that is dreaded by the owners of coal mines and oil wells. (Hazlitt)
What I want to do is to look up C. . . . I call him the Forgotten Man. (Sumner)

Joseph Chikva
Posts: 2039
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:30 am

Post by Joseph Chikva »

For me there is not a big difference between 2016 and 2022.
6 years does not matter if to consider history.

KitemanSA
Posts: 6188
Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 3:05 pm
Location: OlyPen WA

Post by KitemanSA »

Ladajo,
Why do you bother? Joey can't learn anything. He has a mind like a steel trap... that has been rusted shut.

But thank you for your informative posts, even though you can bet big money that it will never soak into Joey's mind.

ladajo
Posts: 6267
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 11:18 pm
Location: North East Coast

Post by ladajo »

Kite, I don't know. I really don't. How many times have I tried now? Lost count.

Joe, you know some physics. You do not know economics. At all.

China seriously lacks infrastructure. One of the biggest 'tells' is in energy use per-capita.

The Dragon Rider is not really controlling the Dragon. This is the most important thing to understand.
The development of atomic power, though it could confer unimaginable blessings on mankind, is something that is dreaded by the owners of coal mines and oil wells. (Hazlitt)
What I want to do is to look up C. . . . I call him the Forgotten Man. (Sumner)

Joseph Chikva
Posts: 2039
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:30 am

Post by Joseph Chikva »

ladajo wrote:Joe, you know some physics. You do not know economics. At all.
Human can not know everything.
But will you still deny the trend by which Chinese GDP will ever overtake American? Will that happen in 2016, 2022 or a little late.
Will you also deny the lack of Chinese debts and existence of huge USA’s debts comparable with GDP?
Image

KitemanSA
Posts: 6188
Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 3:05 pm
Location: OlyPen WA

Post by KitemanSA »

See? Told ya.

Joseph Chikva
Posts: 2039
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:30 am

Post by Joseph Chikva »

KitemanSA wrote:See? Told ya.
Not ya but www.gao.gov
http://www.gao.gov/special.pubs/longter ... tdebt.html
amount that the federal government spends for interest on its debt is directly tied to those interest rates. Under CBO's January 2012 baseline budget projections, debt held by the public would be 62 percent of GDP in 2022 and spending on net interest would rise from $227 billion in 2011 to $624 billion (or 2.5 percent of GDP) in 2022.
Don't splash a saliva.
These are all unbiased facts.

Post Reply