HeheAslan wrote:All of these facilities act under International Atomic Energy Agency's inspectors.
US Condemns Bomb Attack on Iran Nuclear Scientist
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Joseph Chikva
- Posts: 2039
- Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:30 am
So given you have one small research reactor, why do you need so many centrifuges capable of 20% or more enrichment? The numbers do not add up.Aslan wrote:We believe that Iran build centrifuges for making nuclear fuel that are needed only for peaceful nuclear power plants and small research reactors.GIThruster wrote: Iran built centrifuges for making nuclear weapons that are not needed for peaceful nuclear uses.
Your country could easily supply this reactor with other fuel sources as it has in the past. And do so in a manner that would be transparent and cooperative, thus dispelling mistrust.
Fuel for conventional power reactors is perfectly fine at 5%. Why the large scale need for high percentage enrichment? Thousands of centrifuges capable of greater than 20%?
Aslan, I really think that your government has choosen to go the middle road. They will develop the capability to make a weapon when they choose. But by not making a weapon, they can say they are not seeking one.
What is not uinderstood well, is that the ambiguity and stress they bring to the table regarding programs and cooperation continue to further isolate and make the country a pariah.
Please be aware that the major part of world opinion is not supporting Iran. Please also be aware that more countries continue to side against Iran and take active measures against your country. The latest ones are Japan and South Korea. China is even distancing itself, as are the Russians. You can take snap shot sound bites offered by your government controlled media, or you can look at longer trends and actions.
Your own government is feeling the stress to the point it can not even represent itself in a consistent manner. For example some senior leaders saying that they will "blockade" and "close" the Hormuz Strait, while others say that Iran would never do that. All of this because more and more countries are joining in on the sanctions, as well as many making the ones in place more restrictive.
Contrary to what you are saying, the rest of the world does not march to the Israeli Drum. In fact, most of the time, the rest of the world criticises how the Israeli's do things. They are an easy target. But that said, I will also posit that most also understand why the Israeli's do what they do, given they are between a rock and a hard place.
Do you understand how isolated your country is globally these days?
Russia views you as a business opportunity. They are more than happy to profit by selling you things at high prices where others will not. They also find huge convenience in using you as a lever by which to gain influence over everyone else. These days Russia has two levers to pull on, one is supply of energy to Europe, the other is "Iran". They currenlty really do not have anything else to make them matter.
China views you as a cheap and potentially cheaper source of oil. The more the rest of the world stops buying oil from you, the more leverage they have to get cheaper prices from what they buy from you. But you should also note that this is a limited tool, as the Chinese have consistantly been reducing buy levels from Iran over the last ten years as they view the source as un-reliable, and un-certain. They also like to use Iran as a lever to gain influence on other debates as they seek concessions. If you were to chart times where China did not support you or abstained from a UN Vote with times that they got good deals or concessions elsewhere, you may be surprised to find they they use support or not of Iran regularly these days to negotiate other deals.
South Korea is not your friend. They buy oil for price. And soon, they will reduce and stop buying your oil.
North Korea is completely insane. Why would you even think to have them as a friend?
Pakistan has only used Iran as a tool to drive ambitions with Afghanistan and India. They are not your friend.
Venezuela. Chavez. Hmm. I tend to put him in a box with North Korea. Another guy off his rocker, who is intent on a lifetime job of being Dictator of his country.
India. Not your friend. Especially since you keep plauying silly games with Pakistan against them.
Arabs. Both flavors, probably the group that dislikes you most in all the world.
Europeans think you are a nation run by religious nut cases. They wonder why you can not find the historical cultured persians in yourselves. They think you are intent on establishing a Global Islamic Caliphate and using the model of the Ottoman Empire to get it all going. Ironic given that the Ottomans were neither Arab nor Persian.
USA. Wonders why you keep messing with Israel and seem intent on taking over the Middle East. Believes that your government has lost its mind, and is run by religious extremists intent on having everyone join or die with a penchant for eventual world domination.
Things are almost completely out of control for your government now. It will not be long before they lose any semblance of control at all on the world stage.
We are not anti-semitism. We love Jewish and we give them special respect.GIThruster wrote:Interesting that certain people can make arguments based upon what the UN wants, and then ignore the evidence and UN Security Counsel Resolutions when it's convenient for their anti-semitism to plead ignorance.
[(All of Western News Agencies)+(www.presstv.ir)]=Perfect Conclusion.
Which is why senior members of your government persist in saying they must be "removed from the map".Aslan wrote:We are not anti-semitism. We love Jewish and we give them special respect.GIThruster wrote:Interesting that certain people can make arguments based upon what the UN wants, and then ignore the evidence and UN Security Counsel Resolutions when it's convenient for their anti-semitism to plead ignorance.
The irony in all that is how much the Arabs dispise you, yet you persist to think you are helping them and being friends by going after Israel.
Of course, that is also why Bahrain is so ready to "re-join" Iran and stop being the "lost province". Not.
ladajo;ladajo wrote: So given you have one small research reactor, why do you need so many centrifuges capable of 20% or more enrichment? The numbers do not add up.
Your country could easily supply this reactor with other fuel sources as it has in the past. And do so in a manner that would be transparent and cooperative, thus dispelling mistrust.
Fuel for conventional power reactors is perfectly fine at 5%. Why the large scale need for high percentage enrichment? Thousands of centrifuges capable of greater than 20%?
We do not need enriched uranium rather than 20% and we never produce it. Our small research reactor in TEHRAN (Maded by US) produces almost all of our medical radioisotopes for PET and medical applications. you should remember that western governments did not give us our research reactor's fuel then we had to ways:
1- We should stop to produce radioisotopes, then many patients lost their lives.
or
2- We should try to produce research reactor's fuel.
It's very common that we must select the second option.
[(All of Western News Agencies)+(www.presstv.ir)]=Perfect Conclusion.
GIThruster is very quick with throwing accusations of anti semitism arround. I have noticed that before. I consider something like that an ad hominem attack.
Either way, the sad truth is that Iran is run by a bunch of assholes. They think that because Iraq is now gone and the US is weakened by two wars, they can now do whatever they want. They might want to build a nuclear bomb, or they might not. The problem is their attitude. If they were not running arround talking an behaving like insane maniacs, few people would give them the trouble that they are getting right now. However, sentences like "wiping Israel of the face of the earth"and all the other propaganda crap coming from Teheran do scare people. That combined with the thought of these lunatics having nuclear bombs makes them even more scared. And when people are scared of you, they will get agressive towards you.
It is understandable and I can totally relate to the people in the US and also in Israel that are considering all their options right now due to all of this. And this is the sole fault of the Iranian leadership.
That said, I am still calling for moderation and careful consideration of the implications of an all out war with Iran.
1. The US and Israel will loose more sympathies in the region. They will be painted and often also viewed as the agressors. In the long term, this can not be good.
2. Even if Iran had a (one!) nuclear bomb, they would have a (one) bomb that they can not test. If they tested their bomb, they would have the problem of everyone knowing that they have one... or rather had one, because the bomb will be lost in the test (thats how bombs work).
As we know, getting the material for more nuclear bombs is difficult and takes a lot of time (thats why they dont have one yet, duh). So they would probably want to test their design before they build more of it.
So once they have tested their bomb, they will have made themselves a target without having any more bombs to defend themselves. Bad....
On the other hand, a weapon that is untested is worthless and does not serve as a deterrent to neighbours. So it is pointless to have a nuclear bomb that is untested unless you are planning to do some weird all or nothing stunt where you use them in a surprise attack against whoever you want to use it against.
That would of course be a possible option for a nation run by insane people. I however think they are idiots and assholes, but not insane. Either way both of these scenarios described above would probably end with very limited damage done to whoever Irans target would be and Iran being a glass crater...
I am not sure that this is what Irans leadership could want.
3. Iran does have an opposition that could and should be used. I have said that before. There are many people in Iran that are unhappy with the leadership there. Make them understand the risk for the Iranian people that comes from the persuance of this nuclear research and maybe it will get them to take care of matters in their own land. A bit of well placed intelligence and propaganda can help as well. Support the right people at the right moment and a revolution could happen.
4. Another war would spread US forces very thin and cost the US economy dearly. Both are things that I dont think, the US can afford.
I think that such a weekness of the US could be used by other nations to do whatever they want and the US could do nothing about it (cant fight a 4th war). That would be a very dangerous situation.
Either way, the sad truth is that Iran is run by a bunch of assholes. They think that because Iraq is now gone and the US is weakened by two wars, they can now do whatever they want. They might want to build a nuclear bomb, or they might not. The problem is their attitude. If they were not running arround talking an behaving like insane maniacs, few people would give them the trouble that they are getting right now. However, sentences like "wiping Israel of the face of the earth"and all the other propaganda crap coming from Teheran do scare people. That combined with the thought of these lunatics having nuclear bombs makes them even more scared. And when people are scared of you, they will get agressive towards you.
It is understandable and I can totally relate to the people in the US and also in Israel that are considering all their options right now due to all of this. And this is the sole fault of the Iranian leadership.
That said, I am still calling for moderation and careful consideration of the implications of an all out war with Iran.
1. The US and Israel will loose more sympathies in the region. They will be painted and often also viewed as the agressors. In the long term, this can not be good.
2. Even if Iran had a (one!) nuclear bomb, they would have a (one) bomb that they can not test. If they tested their bomb, they would have the problem of everyone knowing that they have one... or rather had one, because the bomb will be lost in the test (thats how bombs work).
As we know, getting the material for more nuclear bombs is difficult and takes a lot of time (thats why they dont have one yet, duh). So they would probably want to test their design before they build more of it.
So once they have tested their bomb, they will have made themselves a target without having any more bombs to defend themselves. Bad....
On the other hand, a weapon that is untested is worthless and does not serve as a deterrent to neighbours. So it is pointless to have a nuclear bomb that is untested unless you are planning to do some weird all or nothing stunt where you use them in a surprise attack against whoever you want to use it against.
That would of course be a possible option for a nation run by insane people. I however think they are idiots and assholes, but not insane. Either way both of these scenarios described above would probably end with very limited damage done to whoever Irans target would be and Iran being a glass crater...
I am not sure that this is what Irans leadership could want.
3. Iran does have an opposition that could and should be used. I have said that before. There are many people in Iran that are unhappy with the leadership there. Make them understand the risk for the Iranian people that comes from the persuance of this nuclear research and maybe it will get them to take care of matters in their own land. A bit of well placed intelligence and propaganda can help as well. Support the right people at the right moment and a revolution could happen.
4. Another war would spread US forces very thin and cost the US economy dearly. Both are things that I dont think, the US can afford.
I think that such a weekness of the US could be used by other nations to do whatever they want and the US could do nothing about it (cant fight a 4th war). That would be a very dangerous situation.
ladajo; We believe that the Zionist mentality (Occupation and Crime and ...) must be eliminated from human society. This does not mean killing, but rather a gradual change in thinking.ladajo wrote:Which is why senior members of your government persist in saying they must be "removed from the map".Aslan wrote:We are not anti-semitism. We love Jewish and we give them special respect.GIThruster wrote:Interesting that certain people can make arguments based upon what the UN wants, and then ignore the evidence and UN Security Counsel Resolutions when it's convenient for their anti-semitism to plead ignorance.
[(All of Western News Agencies)+(www.presstv.ir)]=Perfect Conclusion.
Aslan,
Your government was offered fuel for the test reactor several times. It refused as it wanted to keep the expended plates. I see no problem for you to make fuel for the reactor yourself. I do see problems with the scale you have developed to do so.
Do the math.
Take the known public numbers of functioning centrifuges you now have. Then extrapolate the production capability for all them to 5% in kilograms per year produced. Then take the number of known functioning centrifuges that can enrich to 20%, and run that number out to kg per year capability.
Then take your existing test reactor, as well as the now operating Russian built power plant, and compare the fuel use rates for operation (kg/year) against what you now have in declared centrifuges.
It does not add up. You have way more capacity than needed. It does add up when you put it in terms of weapons grade enrichment.
Iran has systematically expanded and completed more and more chain items and capabilities in the weapons production chain over the last 20 years. And it has done so with less and less transparency. Combine this with increased Rhetoric and irratic provocative behaviour, and your country very much follows the path of North Korea. Please also do not forget the facet of internal unrest and reported government brutality against members of the populace. All this paints a convincing picture of an increasingly unhealthy, irrational, and un-predictable government.
Please note also, that it is not "Zions" that make fake reports of the internal issues. It is Iranians in Iran that risk punishment by posting independantly to the internet or to Western media outlets.
Your government was offered fuel for the test reactor several times. It refused as it wanted to keep the expended plates. I see no problem for you to make fuel for the reactor yourself. I do see problems with the scale you have developed to do so.
Do the math.
Take the known public numbers of functioning centrifuges you now have. Then extrapolate the production capability for all them to 5% in kilograms per year produced. Then take the number of known functioning centrifuges that can enrich to 20%, and run that number out to kg per year capability.
Then take your existing test reactor, as well as the now operating Russian built power plant, and compare the fuel use rates for operation (kg/year) against what you now have in declared centrifuges.
It does not add up. You have way more capacity than needed. It does add up when you put it in terms of weapons grade enrichment.
Iran has systematically expanded and completed more and more chain items and capabilities in the weapons production chain over the last 20 years. And it has done so with less and less transparency. Combine this with increased Rhetoric and irratic provocative behaviour, and your country very much follows the path of North Korea. Please also do not forget the facet of internal unrest and reported government brutality against members of the populace. All this paints a convincing picture of an increasingly unhealthy, irrational, and un-predictable government.
Please note also, that it is not "Zions" that make fake reports of the internal issues. It is Iranians in Iran that risk punishment by posting independantly to the internet or to Western media outlets.
I wish it were so for the way your government sees it.Aslan wrote:ladajo; We believe that the Zionist mentality (Occupation and Crime and ...) must be eliminated from human society. This does not mean killing, but rather a gradual change in thinking.ladajo wrote:Which is why senior members of your government persist in saying they must be "removed from the map".Aslan wrote: We are not anti-semitism. We love Jewish and we give them special respect.
Actions speak louder than words. And in the case of your government they have a declared and comprehensive history of action in support to Hamas and Hezbollah in the pursuit of killing and driving out Jews in Israel.
It is not what you say, it is what you do.
I know, you will once again claim that it is all Zionist lies. And then Friday some Iranian Supreme Council member will lead prayers that end in incited crowd chanting of Death to Zionists, Death to Israel, Death to America, etc. But that never happens really, does it?
ladajo;ladajo wrote:Aslan,
Your government was offered fuel for the test reactor several times. It refused as it wanted to keep the expended plates. I see no problem for you to make fuel for the reactor yourself. I do see problems with the scale you have developed to do so.
Do the math.
Take the known public numbers of functioning centrifuges you now have. Then extrapolate the production capability for all them to 5% in kilograms per year produced. Then take the number of known functioning centrifuges that can enrich to 20%, and run that number out to kg per year capability.
Then take your existing test reactor, as well as the now operating Russian built power plant, and compare the fuel use rates for operation (kg/year) against what you now have in declared centrifuges.
Unfotunately I must say that you are wrong. Due to the low efficiency of our centrifuges, outputs of these chains is more less than fuel is needed in Tehran and Bushehr reactors. Also I should say that all of them act under IAEA's inspectors and protocoles.
[(All of Western News Agencies)+(www.presstv.ir)]=Perfect Conclusion.
ladajo; please be more carefull about your major sentence; It is not what you say, it is what you do. it is the key.ladajo wrote: It is not what you say, it is what you do.
I know, you will once again claim that it is all Zionist lies. And then Friday some Iranian Supreme Council member will lead prayers that end in incited crowd chanting of Death to Zionists, Death to Israel, Death to America, etc. But that never happens really, does it?
unfortunately, we just say Death to Zionists, Death to Israel, .... but Israel does it for all muslims in Palestine, Iran, Turkey, Iraq, ..............
[(All of Western News Agencies)+(www.presstv.ir)]=Perfect Conclusion.
Israel calls for "regime change" in the five countries mentioned in the policy document "Clean break."Skipjack wrote:Aslan, when has Israel called for the death of all muslims in Turkey and Iraq, or anywhere? I cant remember the Israeli leaders ever saying anything like that.
How do you do that without invading the countries and killing lots of its inhabitants? (Three down, two to go.)
Would it be OK for Iran to call for a "regime change" in Israel? I don't think so. Israel would call that a threat big enough to bomb them.
Wow, parallel, dude...
I am calling for a regime change in a lot of countries, not just muslim countries my own country and the US included.
In fact, I think that most countries could need some fresh wind and a wakeup call for the old, fat and oh so secure of their positions politicians.
BUT, whenever I do that, I am thinking of the use of peaceful means. In democracies this is usually an election? So e.g. Turkey would have a regime change (ideally with the lunatic Erdogan being replaced by non religious right, maybe atheistic leader) at the next election? You know, Turkey is a democracy (still anyway, bless Kemal Pasha).
Same goes for Austria and the US, well that country needs at least one more political party that is a true opposition to the other two...
But that is all a regime change with the means of democracy. No war, no killing of civilians needed...
As for non democratic countries... a regime change can happen there too, maybe with a peaceful revolution (look at Eastern Germany or Hungria at the end of the cold war), or maybe with minor blood shed (Romania at the end of the cold war). Again no invasion needed, no killing of lots of its inhabitants...
I think you are putting words into peoples mouths there!
I am calling for a regime change in a lot of countries, not just muslim countries my own country and the US included.
In fact, I think that most countries could need some fresh wind and a wakeup call for the old, fat and oh so secure of their positions politicians.
BUT, whenever I do that, I am thinking of the use of peaceful means. In democracies this is usually an election? So e.g. Turkey would have a regime change (ideally with the lunatic Erdogan being replaced by non religious right, maybe atheistic leader) at the next election? You know, Turkey is a democracy (still anyway, bless Kemal Pasha).
Same goes for Austria and the US, well that country needs at least one more political party that is a true opposition to the other two...
But that is all a regime change with the means of democracy. No war, no killing of civilians needed...
As for non democratic countries... a regime change can happen there too, maybe with a peaceful revolution (look at Eastern Germany or Hungria at the end of the cold war), or maybe with minor blood shed (Romania at the end of the cold war). Again no invasion needed, no killing of lots of its inhabitants...
I think you are putting words into peoples mouths there!
Dont be ridiculous. Iran has been getting away with a lot worse for decades now.Would it be OK for Iran to call for a "regime change" in Israel? I don't think so. Israel would call that a threat big enough to bomb them.
And you do, not just say.Aslan wrote:ladajo; please be more carefull about your major sentence; It is not what you say, it is what you do. it is the key.ladajo wrote: It is not what you say, it is what you do.
I know, you will once again claim that it is all Zionist lies. And then Friday some Iranian Supreme Council member will lead prayers that end in incited crowd chanting of Death to Zionists, Death to Israel, Death to America, etc. But that never happens really, does it?
unfortunately, we just say Death to Zionists, Death to Israel, .... but Israel does it for all muslims in Palestine, Iran, Turkey, Iraq, ..............
Lets see, just this past week, 5 trucks siezed in Turkey smuggling "military equipment" from Iran to Syria.
Or how about the shipment of Gold and Cash being smuggled in a truck driven by the son of A senior Revolutionary Guard officer to Lebanon via Turkey in 2009.
Or how about an arms shipment being flown from Iran by airplane being forced to land and siezed in Turkey while enroute to guess where?
Oh, and not to mention flights that were turned around in Turkish Airspace.
Should we also talk about ships from Iran with smuggled arms cargoes going to Palistinians?
I know, these are all lies made up by the Zionists.
If you want to understand better about your countries programs, try this paper when you get a chance. It is a decent all around study of your capacities and developments.
http://www.npolicy.org/article_file/An_ ... eapons.pdf