jmc wrote:MSimon wrote:That it is safe to emit CO2 is not some trivial thing that any school child would know the answer to...
CO2 has been up to 7,000 ppmv in geological time. No tipping point.
OTOH man made CO2 has special properties (caused by quantum entanglement with humans) that makes it prone to wild temperature swings and tipping points.
This is based on Mann's Determinism Theory. Which states "I have determined CO2 is bad. Fall in line or else."
So yes It is possible that things are really bad. It is even possible that they are worse than we thought. What are the odds?
But I agree. We should be doing something about CO2 where it is profitable to do so. Planting trees. Growing crops. Seem to work out well in that respect.
No tipping point??? Your talking geological time!!!!!
100's of millions of years over the those time periods there are plenty of tipping points, climatic phase changes, mass extinctions. Some life always survives and adapts to the new environment, but for most organisms a mass extinction isn't a particularly fun time to be around in..
Anyhow over 100's millions of years the Earth's temperaturre has been dramatically different (well 10 degrees anyhow).
You just trolling? Why do you use the fact that there was a geological precedent of far higher CO2 concentrations 100's millions of years ago to argue that changing CO2 will not cause climate to change when the climate
has changed over that period and many organisms
have gone extinct.
This line of argument has no logic to it.
OK let me amend that. There is no evidence that changes in atmospheric CO2 caused any of the tipping points you refer to. Which is what I meant in the first place.
And they may not be tipping points. Just coincidences in cycles of non-harmonically related oscillators.
Climate changed. CO2 changed. So? It takes a little more than that to prove cause and effect. You are not discussing with rubes here. Typically you would like to see CO2 changes precede temperature changes. Sometimes they do by a little. Sometimes they seem coincident. Mostly delayed by 200 to 800 years.
If CO2 is a cause it is a weak cause. If it is an effect (release from warmer oceans) it is a rather strong effect.
But OK. A 1 deg C increase from doubling from 280 ppmv. We are at about 380. At 2 ppmv per year we will get there in 90 years. In 90 years the natural evolution of technology will have us off fossil fuels without crash programs and mass hysteria. Suppose the rate increases .1ppmv a year. CO2 will have doubled in about 43 years. We should be well on our way to other technologies by then.
But suppose we just keep burning at an ever increasing rate until it is all gone. It will take 103 years.
In 103 years we will have invented lots of new stuff.
You know who we have to reign in? China and India. Because the USA and Europe CO2 output has been relatively flat by comparison.
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