China Unveils Yet Another Stealth Jet: Shenyang J-31

djolds1 · Post by **djolds1** » Sat Sep 22, 2012 1:37 am

ladajo wrote:There is a strong argument about the current behavior of the Chinese Regime being driven by internal concerns.

If you wish to explore some, one of the leading advocates of this view, is Dr. Robert Ross from Boston College.

The ideas have some merit, especially when coupled with an understanding of internal Chinese System Disconnects.

Ross aruges that China, since 2008/09 especially, has faced an unprecendented (in its own perception) internal control crisis.
One of Ross's supporting arguments invovles a comparison of internal police and national police type spending compared to military spending. Ironically, I was just talking to him about this stuff the day before yesterday.

Yes - the regime's increased emphasis on internal control has been evident for a few years. Precisely what they fear has not been as evident.

Skipjack · Post by **Skipjack** » Sat Sep 22, 2012 2:12 am

Yes - the regime's increased emphasis on internal control has been evident for a few years. Precisely what they fear has not been as evident.

Well, it I dont know who made the famous quote, it might have even been Confucius himself, but it certainly has some merit:
"Dictators rarely die in bed"... and that might be just what they are concerned about.

93143 · Post by **93143** » Mon Sep 24, 2012 6:05 pm

Stalin did.

choff · Post by **choff** » Mon Sep 24, 2012 8:47 pm

He died because his guards were so afraid of being killed if they disturbed him, that when they heard him dying through the door they wouldn't go in.

Skipjack · Post by **Skipjack** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 12:36 am

Stalin did.

Well yes and so did a few others. I guess the hunor was a bit too subtle...

paperburn1 · Post by **paperburn1** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 2:43 pm

ladajo wrote:There is a strong argument about the current behavior of the Chinese Regime being driven by internal concerns.

The ideas have some merit, especially when coupled with an understanding of internal Chinese System Disconnects.

Ross aruges that China, since 2008/09 especially, has faced an unprecendented (in its own perception) internal control crisis.
One of Ross's supporting arguments invovles a comparison of internal police and national police type spending compared to military spending. Ironically, I was just talking to him about this stuff the day before yesterday.

I would say it more so the glut of unbacked unsecured credit the Chinese banks have been loaning on the precious and industrial metals that do not exist in the warehouses. Different loans secured multiple times with the same assets. If one major player defaults the whole house could come tumbling down.

ladajo · Post by **ladajo** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 2:49 pm

Yes, it is factual that the Chinese economic system is corrupt.

But that does not address the internal stressors that it is argued that government feels in regard to the populace. Nor explain the dramatic raises in national police spending, especially when compared to military spending.

paperburn1 · Post by **paperburn1** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 3:46 pm

ladajo wrote:Yes, it is factual that the Chinese economic system is corrupt.

But that does not address the internal stressors that it is argued that government feels in regard to the populace. Nor explain the dramatic raises in national police spending, especially when compared to military spending.

Firm control of discontent has been a defining policy of China's government, especially since the pro-democracy protests of 1989 that ended in a bloody crackdown and Party patriarch Deng Xiaoping's demand that "stability comes before all else." Rapid economic growth over the past two decades has rekindled official worries that social flux and inequality could unsettle Party control. President Hu chaired a meeting in September 2010 that studied the social strains facing the country. He warned officials to be ready for a rough patch. Yet the government's single-minded demand for officials to snuff out symptoms of unrest is skewing resources and attention away from social needs and into paying cops to monitor and detain potential protesters, Most of this is due to a new phenomena that has not been experienced before in china. The Protestant work ethic. The new wave of Christianity has developed a middle class that has the potential to undermined the ruling elite. With money to spend and a reputation for not being corrupt more people of the Chinese republic are turning to do business with them and other foreign national company's on the coast. this is resulting in more and more micro protests that the ruling party feels my one day bloom out of control. For the past few years they have been spending more and more to get a handle on the problem and the 200 million migrants farm workers that have moved to the city for jobs. They see the social inequity's directly in the fact they can not get permitted residence in the "wealthy" cities and are becoming more and more vocal about not receiving fair and equitable treatment. The ruling party sees this as a powder keg ready to explode and this is In the run-up to this autumn's Communist Party Congress, at which China will change its most senior leaders for the first time in ten years, provincial- and lower-level party committees have already been revamped.

paperburn1 · Post by **paperburn1** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 4:09 pm

http://www.economist.com/node/21557760 a very good piece on the police force and 610
http://www.jamestown.org/programs/china ... e280ce9725

ladajo · Post by **ladajo** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 4:22 pm

Yes, I agree with all. As well as the reported levels of internal protest are at unprecedented levels. Not counting the un-reported...

Skipjack · Post by **Skipjack** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:15 pm

ended in a bloody crackdown and Party patriarch Deng Xiaoping's demand that "stability comes before all else

Actually Xiaoping's influence was at an all time low at the time. He himself got cought up quite a bit in the noise and the resulting power struggle between the socialist hardliners in his country and more reform oriented politicians like himself. If you are blaming him for that, then you are barking up the wrong tree.

paperburn1 · Post by **paperburn1** » Wed Sep 26, 2012 1:45 pm

Skipjack wrote:
ended in a bloody crackdown and Party patriarch Deng Xiaoping's demand that "stability comes before all else
Actually Xiaoping's influence was at an all time low at the time. He himself got cought up quite a bit in the noise and the resulting power struggle between the socialist hardliners in his country and more reform oriented politicians like himself. If you are blaming him for that, then you are barking up the wrong tree.

Those were his words at the Sept conference not mine.A consensus has been reached by the outgoing Politburo Standing Committee (PBSC) that the size of this highest ruling council should be cut from nine to seven members. Barring any last minute changes, the new PBSC is expected to consist of the following (and their prospective portfolios): Xi, age 59 (General Secretary and President); Li Keqiang, age 57 (Premier); Yu Zhengsheng, age 67 (Chairman of the National People’s Congress); Zhang Dejiang, age 65 (Chairman of the Chinese People’s Political Consultative Conference); Li Yuanchao, age 61 (Head of the Party Secretariat and Vice President); Wang Qishan, age 64 (Executive Vice Premier); and Wang Yang, age 57 (Secretary of the Central Commission for Disciplinary Inspection [CCDI]). The seven-member configuration is an effort by the leadership to return to the norm. Since the Cultural Revolution, the PBSC had consisted of either five or seven members.
It must be noted, however, that retooling party and State Council organs belong in the realm of administrative restructuring, not political liberalization or structural political reform. From signals that have been emitted by official media, the chances of General Secretary Hu unveiling major reform initiatives in his much-anticipated Political Report to the 18th Party Congress, which will set the stage for the party’s policies in the coming five years, do not seem high.
http://www.jamestown.org/programs/china ... 4ee9e9fe38

DeltaV · Post by **DeltaV** » Thu Nov 01, 2012 2:29 pm

J-31 flies. Looks like a twin-engine F-35.

Hacking US/Euro F-35 contractors in 2009 paid off. Saved them years and years of R&D.

China’s Newest Stealth Fighter Takes Flight

Yet another disaster due to the Kumbaya/It Takes a Village/Cloud Is The Future progressive crap that the US defense industry has been feeding itself for the past decade.

ladajo · Post by **ladajo** » Thu Nov 01, 2012 2:35 pm

Just remember that looking stealth and being stealth are two different things. Also the Chinese still don't make high performance engines, it remains beyond them (albiet for now). The other most important thing that makes an aircraft Gen 5, is not how it looks as much as whats in it for avionics, sensors, comms, weapons, countermeasures, etc.

Skipjack · Post by **Skipjack** » Thu Nov 01, 2012 2:40 pm

Totally agree wtih ladajo there.
Just because it looks simillar does not mean that is performs simillar...