Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

[Diogenes]

The salient point has nothing to do with the specifics of whatever conduct is being prohibited. It makes no difference if it is "sex" or "murder" the argument put forth is that it is the PROHIBITION of the conduct that causes more of it.

And you pretend to understand people.

That understanding is quite fortunate. Because once you have it you can start ordering people around. Or at least support those that do.

My understanding is simple. You allow broken windows, you get burned down buildings.

The great fear is that some how. Some where. Someone is going to do something I don't approve of. And that doing is sure to bring down civilization faster that the wielders of the fasces ever can.

I don't approve of murder. Obviously I am a despot.

Except we know from history that it is the holders of the fasces who are most dangerous to civilization. After all they hung a great spiritual leader - revered by so many in America - out to dry. Just an inconvenient fact best forgotten.

As someone famous once said, "Render unto Caesar those things which are Caesar's (Earthly power) and Render unto God those things which are God's." (Spiritual essence.)

Seems like they simply followed that doctrine, eh? Spiritualists might want to stay out of power struggles else they may end up ruling in the afterlife. Rasputin also comes to mind.

[MSimon]

I'd really like to pick your brains in person for a quarter hour or two MSimon. One of these days.

Love to. I don't travel much these days so some where in America would be a good plan. But if someone with a private jet wants to fly me about I'm good to go.

[MSimon]

I don't approve of punishing people for things they do to themselves. So obviously I favor liberty.

Once you take the opposite view you have to control everything and everyone. Because the methods of self harm are near infinite. Trans-fat say. For starters. And in America they have already started.

"Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add 'within the limits of the law' because law is often but the tyrant's will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual." -- Thomas Jefferson

[Skipjack]

Oral sex is a go in all states of the Union... woop!

Good, I like oral sex, nice to have some variation...

[Betruger]

I'd really like to pick your brains in person for a quarter hour or two MSimon. One of these days.

Love to. I don't travel much these days so some where in America would be a good plan. But if someone with a private jet wants to fly me about I'm good to go.

I'm on the east coast. I'll find a free couple of days to stop by in the coming year.

[MSimon]

I'd really like to pick your brains in person for a quarter hour or two MSimon. One of these days.

Love to. I don't travel much these days so some where in America would be a good plan. But if someone with a private jet wants to fly me about I'm good to go.

I'm on the east coast. I'll find a free couple of days to stop by in the coming year.

Excellent.

[Diogenes]

I don't approve of punishing people for things they do to themselves. So obviously I favor liberty.

You favor slogans. You refuse to see where the behavior affects others.

Again with this example.


FLASHBACK: Homeless Lady with 15 Kids: ‘Somebody Needs to Pay for All My Children’




http://nation.foxnews.com/homelessness/ ... y-children


Your "liberty" is someone else's enslavement. When *YOU* pay the bills for them, THEN you have the moral authority to indulge them in doing whatever they want.

[KitemanSA]

Both too much and too little is toxic.

Sorry, not how the J-Curve works. "Too little" yields less benefit, but is NOT toxic. Too MUCH is T O X I C ! ! !

I do not understand how you can say that. If you reduce government to the point where it does not or can not enforce the laws, you create a power vacuum into which a strong man will step and HE will be the law. This is the legacy of Drug addiction in China, with Mao Tse Tung stepping into the power vacuum.

Sounds like your contention is that "since too little inevitably leads to too much, you may as well have too much. Sorry, but this sounds a bit silly to me.
I decline to accept your contention. But it doesn't really matter. How bout "just right". Not too much, not too little. That is the Libertarian mantra.

[KitemanSA]

According to my definition, Libertarians are the opposite extreme from Liberals. Liberals want Total government, Libertarians want none.

As I said right above, your understanding of what it means to be "libertarian" is faulty and misleading. Liberatarians are NOT anarchists. Min-archists, maybe, but not ANarchists.
Liberals don't want total government, they only want the government to totally control HALF your life. But then, so do conservatives (in everyone's definition but your own). They just argue about which half, and never repair the damage done by the other folk when they take power. So as it happens, both liberals and conservatives are TOOLS of the authoritarians who DO what TOTAL government control of your life.
How bout that! You are a TOOL!

Can you point to a functional Libertarian society in History? I believe the ones that were attempted were called "libertine" and didn't last very long.

With certain weeping sores like slavery, the first half of the 19th century US approximated it.

It didn't last long enough either, but seems like a positive thing to try to recapture the better parts of that society.

[KitemanSA]

Double post. Internet acting funny today.

In the future, how about just deleting it? If it doesn't say at the bottom that you edited it when you wrote "double post"..., you could have deleted it.

[MSimon]

My liberty is some one else's enslavement?

No, the big government you favor for your pet projects is enslaving you. Funny. It stares you in the face. See your above. And you fail to notice.

Both of the big government parties complain about the projects of the other party. Neither is willing to look itself in the mirror and say, "my love of government solutions empowers my enemies".

I know plenty of leftists who are mirror images of you.

Neither side so far is willing to give up its love of fascist (in the fasces sense) solutions. "We can beat people into submission with the strong arm of the law" is always self defeating. More so in America than any other place in the world. You ought to find another way. Or nature will self correct eventually. And those kinds of events are often quite unpleasant. Esp. for those who do not live through them. I expect to be on the top of the target lists of both sides. And I'm proud of it. Molon labe.

[KitemanSA]

I don't approve of murder. Obviously I am a despot.

No, what indicates your despotic tendencies is your appearant inability to distinguish between CRIME and VICE. Both are often illegal, many times they are both felonies. But one is WRONG and the other is just bad.

[KitemanSA]

I don't approve of punishing people for things they do to themselves. So obviously I favor liberty.

You favor slogans. You refuse to see where the behavior affects others.

Again with this example.


FLASHBACK: Homeless Lady with 15 Kids: ‘Somebody Needs to Pay for All My Children’

Proper response...

"Yeah! YOU do!!!"

[MSimon]

I have some more thoughts on the issue here:

viewtopic.php?t=3433

[Diogenes]

My liberty is some one else's enslavement?

No, what you are CALLING "liberty" is actually someone else's enslavement. The Self indulgent reckless behavior you champion tends to leave other people footing the bill, be it in money or heartache.

No, the big government you favor for your pet projects is enslaving you.

I don't believe in "big" government. I believe in normal sized government (which is a lot smaller than what we have now) which enforces reasonable laws. The Big government that LIBERALS want, is enslaving me.

Funny. It stares you in the face. See your above. And you fail to notice.

Both of the big government parties complain about the projects of the other party. Neither is willing to look itself in the mirror and say, "my love of government solutions empowers my enemies".

We've gone over this before. What you are calling a "project" I call ordinary law enforcement.

I know plenty of leftists who are mirror images of you. .

Perhaps in your funhouse mirror version of things. What you see is a distortion.

Neither side so far is willing to give up its love of fascist (in the fasces sense) solutions. "We can beat people into submission with the strong arm of the law" is always self defeating.

Are you saying that we should not enforce any laws? Or are you saying we should only enforce laws you agree with?

More so in America than any other place in the world. You ought to find another way. Or nature will self correct eventually. And those kinds of events are often quite unpleasant. Esp. for those who do not live through them. I expect to be on the top of the target lists of both sides. And I'm proud of it. Molon labe.

I keep telling YOU about nature correcting the problem. You seem to have a very different idea about what nature is going to do than do I. Nature corrected the Chinese Drug problem, and it will correct the drug problem of any other nation which follows that road, and it will do it with the exact same results. Dictatorship.