67 Percent of Republicans - End Medical Marijuana Crackdown

MSimon · Post by **MSimon** » Sat Jul 28, 2012 11:02 am

A poll conducted earlier this month by Mason-Dixon Polling & Research on behalf of the Marijuana Policy Project finds that 76 percent of Americans want President Barack Obama to end his crackdown on medical marijuana in states where medicinal use of the plant is legal.

According to MPP's release, "Support for keeping the federal government out of state medical marijuana issues was universal across all demographics. With respect to political affiliation, 75% of Democrats, 67% of Republicans, and, notably 79% of Independents said that President Obama should respect state medical marijuana laws. Even among the least supportive group (those identified as over 65 years of age), 64% were in favor of respecting state law."

74 Percent of Americans, Including 67 Percent of Republicans, Want Obama to End Medical Marijuana Crackdown

It is nice to see so many commenters here on Obama's side. He is going to need your votes.

More here including why drug laws are lowering clearance rates for crimes like murder, robbery, and theft.

http://classicalvalues.com/2012/07/obam ... than-bush/

Diogenes · Post by **Diogenes** » Sat Jul 28, 2012 6:59 pm

I used to think the stuff was pretty harmless, but your constant obsession and harping on it tends to convince me that it has psychological effects that trend dangerous.

You are turning me from a tepid "blah" opponent, to one of active and intensifying opposition, and I NEVER found this topic interesting! I guess if you keep forcing people to pay attention to this to the point where they are sick of hearing about it, it won't be long before they start seeing more reasons than just the obvious to oppose it.

You have now got me thinking I ought to start making Anti-Drug PSAs to post on youtube. I've got plenty of great ideas on how to go about it. I don't think the public is aware that we've already tried your drug legalization experiments and they ended in unmitigated disaster.

Even the Dutch are now re-thinking their liberal attitudes regarding pot. I think it would make a great commercial! Same thing with China. Same thing with Platzspitz.

hanelyp · Post by **hanelyp** » Sat Jul 28, 2012 10:22 pm

I suspect many illicit drugs have medical application under direct supervision of a qualified physician. The medical pot movement, however, seems intent on opening up the drug for recreational use, absent any medical supervision needed to stave off problems associated with abuse.

palladin9479 · Post by **palladin9479** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 4:27 am

hanelyp wrote:I suspect many illicit drugs have medical application under direct supervision of a qualified physician. The medical pot movement, however, seems intent on opening up the drug for recreational use, absent any medical supervision needed to stave off problems associated with abuse.

That's the funny part, THC isn't addictive. There can be no more abuse then there is of nicotine. On the other hand Methylcarbinol is addictive and current society is fraught with abuse of it.

So tell us, are you saying that smokers and drivers should only smoke / drink under direct supervision of a qualified physician?

The same thing that happened to the prohibition of Methylcarbinol will happen to the prohibition of THC. It's only a matter of time, mostly for all the old assholes to die off.

Seriously, who would of ever thought that modern medicines ability to prolong life would turn into such a social problem.

MSimon · Post by **MSimon** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 5:35 am

palladin9479 wrote:
hanelyp wrote:I suspect many illicit drugs have medical application under direct supervision of a qualified physician. The medical pot movement, however, seems intent on opening up the drug for recreational use, absent any medical supervision needed to stave off problems associated with abuse.
That's the funny part, THC isn't addictive. There can be no more abuse then there is of nicotine. On the other hand Methylcarbinol is addictive and current society is fraught with abuse of it.

So tell us, are you saying that smokers and drivers should only smoke / drink under direct supervision of a qualified physician?

The same thing that happened to the prohibition of Methylcarbinol will happen to the prohibition of THC. It's only a matter of time, mostly for all the old assholes to die off.

Seriously, who would of ever thought that modern medicines ability to prolong life would turn into such a social problem.

That may be about to change:

From: http://classicalvalues.com/2012/07/is-it-medicine/

Late last week Americans for Safe Access (ASA) got some exciting news: the United States Court of Appeals for the D.C. Circuit agreed to hear oral arguments in Americans for Safe Access v. Drug Enforcement Administration. Ten years after original rescheduling petition was filed, the courts will finally review the scientific evidence regarding the therapeutic value of cannabis!

MSimon · Post by **MSimon** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 5:59 am

One for the old assholes - The CB1 and CB2 systems are pervasive in the body. They were discovered (at least the CB1 system) by an Israeli, Dr. Raphael Mechoulam, because the FDA and the DEA effectively squelched all research that was not primarily anti drug.

And the most effective drug for treating problems in those systems? THC and cannabinoids. And the number 1 problem is that no one will market those drugs in competition with grown cannabis because given the research costs they would be unprofitable.

I wrote in: http://powerandcontrol.blogspot.com/200 ... ation.html

It turns out that anxiety disorders are the most common mental health problem in the United States. They are worth $46 billion a year to the pharmaceutical industry. You don't suppose this fact has any thing to do with the pharmaceutical industries being in the forefront of the Drug Free America campaign do you? Of course not. They are just trying to keep you from being addicted to natural products at the cost of 1/10th of a cent per dose when they are more than willing to sell you an FDA and doctor approved, pharmacy sold product that will do the job for a dollar a dose. They have only your best interests at heart. Just ask their accountants.

=======

Cannabis is one of the least toxic anti-anxiety medicines known to man.

Tobacco is also an anti-anxiety drug. One of the more toxic known to man. It takes some effort but you can smoke enough in one sitting to kill yourself. That is not true of cannabis.

The illegal drug cartels are not the only drug cartels that are causing problems.

Paracetamol (or acetaminophen in the U.S.A.) is metabolically combined with arachidonic acid by FAAH to form AM404.[17] This metabolite of paracetamol is a potent agonist at the TRPV1 vanilloid receptor, a weak agonist at both CB1 and CB2 receptors, and an inhibitor of anandamide reuptake. As a result, anandamide levels in the body and brain are elevated. In this fashion, paracetamol acts as a pro-drug for a cannabimimetic metabolite. This action may be partially or fully responsible for the analgesic effects of paracetamol.[18][19]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anandamide

Acetaminophen is known to be highly toxic and long term use is discouraged. So why not just increase the cannabinoid level directly? Well that would be illegal.

Now if only the old assholes had put as much time into researching this as they had into Polywell they might still be old but they would no longer be assholes. Some people prefer to remain ignorant. An attitude that always amazed me. I do pity the fools.

hanelyp · Post by **hanelyp** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 6:46 pm

palladin9479 wrote:
hanelyp wrote:I suspect many illicit drugs have medical application under direct supervision of a qualified physician. The medical pot movement, however, seems intent on opening up the drug for recreational use, absent any medical supervision needed to stave off problems associated with abuse.
...
So tell us, are you saying that smokers and drivers should only smoke / drink under direct supervision of a qualified physician?
...

I was trying to point out a fallacy regarding medicinal value of abuse able drugs. I don't see a mass movement promoting tobacco and ethanol as medicine.

seedload · Post by **seedload** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 7:10 pm

What is being argued for in these threads anymore anyway? Is it doctor prescribed pot or is it totally legal over the counter any drug (Crack at K-Mart)? Are these in any way equivalent? I don't think so. Why does support for one equal support for the other? Why would medical evidence of the usefulness of the first be considered evidence for the need for the second? Does the OP even understand that some people support prescribed pot or even legalized pot but that they consider OTC Ruffies to be a bad idea?

Equating support for medical marajuana to support for the end of prohibition on all drugs is like equating support for cap guns to supporting TNT for everyone.

Diogenes · Post by **Diogenes** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 9:34 pm

seedload wrote:What is being argued for in these threads anymore anyway? Is it doctor prescribed pot or is it totally legal over the counter any drug (Crack at K-Mart)?

Yes. That is exactly what is being argued for. MSimon regards it as a foundational principle of his philosophy that no one has a right to stop anyone from taking anything they so desire. He is simply using the pot argument in an attempt to justify opening this door, but his ultimate goal (as he will readily admit) is to eliminate all restrictions on any and every drug.

Yes, he wants Crack to be available at K-Mart, or any where else that wishes to sell it.

All this time and you were still unclear about what was being discussed?

seedload wrote: Are these in any way equivalent? I don't think so. Why does support for one equal support for the other? Why would medical evidence of the usefulness of the first be considered evidence for the need for the second? Does the OP even understand that some people support prescribed pot or even legalized pot but that they consider OTC Ruffies to be a bad idea?

He's hoping to win you over to full support for the legalization of all drugs based on the strength of his arguments for legalization. So far, opposition to legalizing any and all drugs is:

1. Tyrannical
2. Racist
3. Sadistic to people in pain.
4. Un-American
5. Unnatural and perverted.
6. Liberal/Progressive
7. Ignorant of the Medical Science involved.
8. Futile, because they are going to do it anyway.
9 Too expensive for the Nation to afford.
10 Causes Crime.
11 Supports foreign criminals.
12. Imposes morality.
13. A Baptist/Bootlegger coalition...
14 Empowers Government.
15 And so on...

It reminds me of Calvin voicing his displeasure at being told "no."

seedload wrote: Equating support for medical marajuana to support for the end of prohibition on all drugs is like equating support for cap guns to supporting TNT for everyone.

What are you? Some kind of Tyrannical, Racist, Sadistic , Un-American , perverted, Progressive, Ignorant, Time-wasting , spendthrifty, crime-supporting, morality imposing, foreign criminal supporting, government empowering Baptist or something?

Everybody ought to have a right to play with TNT. The government ought not be allowed to ban dangerous substances or materials. Don't you know? Prohibition doesn't work!

palladin9479 · Post by **palladin9479** » Thu Aug 02, 2012 5:12 am

seedload wrote:What is being argued for in these threads anymore anyway? Is it doctor prescribed pot or is it totally legal over the counter any drug (Crack at K-Mart)? Are these in any way equivalent? I don't think so. Why does support for one equal support for the other? Why would medical evidence of the usefulness of the first be considered evidence for the need for the second? Does the OP even understand that some people support prescribed pot or even legalized pot but that they consider OTC Ruffies to be a bad idea?

Equating support for medical marajuana to support for the end of prohibition on all drugs is like equating support for cap guns to supporting TNT for everyone.

THC shouldn't be anywhere on the scheduled list of controlled substances. It does not post a danger to public health. It as only put on that list during a fit of extreme moral conservatism (if it feels good it must be a sin and amoral). Methylcarbinol is substantially more dangerous to humans, not only is it a poison but in moderate quantities it causes judgement impairment irrational behavior, and emotional instability. THC is in the same category as Nicotine with the sole exception being that Nicotine forms a chemical dependency (physical addiction) in the brain while THC doesn't. Hell caffeine is more dangerous to you then THC is and what F*CKED UP world would we be if we didn't have our coffee.

Substances should only be on the scheduled lists if it can be proven to have a harmful effect on public health. I do believe heroine, methamphetamine's and various opiates would qualify, though so would rat poison and it's legal to buy.

palladin9479 · Post by **palladin9479** » Thu Aug 02, 2012 5:17 am

hanelyp wrote:
palladin9479 wrote:
hanelyp wrote:I suspect many illicit drugs have medical application under direct supervision of a qualified physician. The medical pot movement, however, seems intent on opening up the drug for recreational use, absent any medical supervision needed to stave off problems associated with abuse.
...
So tell us, are you saying that smokers and drivers should only smoke / drink under direct supervision of a qualified physician?
...
I was trying to point out a fallacy regarding medicinal value of abuse able drugs. I don't see a mass movement promoting tobacco and ethanol as medicine.

THC shouldn't be medicinal only, it should be as regulated and available as the other legal recreational drugs Methylcarbinol, Nicotine and Caffeine.

Just last weekend I participated in recreational drug use with my social friends including several attractive girls. We consumed Methylcarbinol in large quantities, some of them even inhaled nicotine. The next morning to overcome to symptoms of the toxic Methylcarbinol I consumed caffeine. How immoral and utterly dangerous to society I am. Going about consuming recreational drugs like that, with them wemin folk even.

palladin9479 · Post by **palladin9479** » Thu Aug 02, 2012 5:39 am

And now for the Coup de grâce.

Now that we've established that Tetrahydrocannabinol is less toxic then Methylcarbinol, Nicotine and Caffeine.

Anyone who supports the prohibition on Tetrahydrocannabinol must therefor logically support the prohibition of the recreational drugs Methylcarbinol, Nicotine and Caffeine.

Doing otherwise would be both irrational and illogical. Anyone supporting the prohibition of Tetrahydrocannabinol while abusing the recreational drugs Methylcarbinol, Nicotine and Caffeine is a hypocrite and does not deserve the title Scientist or Engineer.

Now come on, justify the legal status of the potentially harmful recreational drugs Methylcarbinol, Nicotine and Caffeine while trying to simultaneously justify the legal status of the recreational drug Tetrahydrocannabinol.

randomencounter · Post by **randomencounter** » Thu Aug 02, 2012 2:10 pm

Yeah, everyone who supports drug legalization just wants an easier supply.

It couldn't possibly be that people are more afraid of police with too much power than they are of lazy f-in hippies who take too many drugs.

hanelyp · Post by **hanelyp** » Thu Aug 02, 2012 6:10 pm

To cite Sony vs. Betamax (not a drug related case), does the substance in question have a usage consistent with civil and legal conduct?

More specific to drugs, does the substance in question impair judgement?

GIThruster · Post by **GIThruster** » Thu Aug 02, 2012 6:16 pm

palladin9479 wrote:And now for the Coup de grâce.

Now that we've established that Tetrahydrocannabinol is less toxic then Methylcarbinol, Nicotine and Caffeine.

Anyone who supports the prohibition on Tetrahydrocannabinol must therefor logically support the prohibition of the recreational drugs Methylcarbinol, Nicotine and Caffeine.

THC is an hallucinogen that increases the likelihood of a user suffering a psychotic episode by more than 5,000%. It also destroys ambition, makes people lazy under-achievers and promotes dishonesty.

You can dance around these facts all you like, but this won't make you less a moron for your opinion.