I'm tired of feeling like a sucker. I'm tired of working hard, putting up with crazy bosses and having what I earn being eaten up by taxes so that I can pay for somebody else's lifestyle who make no contribution or actually does any work. Especially since I have to sacrifice and scrimp and deal with having bad credit because I save instead of spend.:
http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=70501
working For Two
Re: working For Two
americans complaining about taxes is always funny, considering how incredibly low taxes are in the US.Jccarlton wrote:I'm tired of feeling like a sucker. I'm tired of working hard, putting up with crazy bosses and having what I earn being eaten up by taxes so that I can pay for somebody else's lifestyle who make no contribution or actually does any work. Especially since I have to sacrifice and scrimp and deal with having bad credit because I save instead of spend.:
http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=70501
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kunkmiester
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Re: working For Two
Low? Well let's see. Everything I buy is taxed at 8 3/4 cents right off the top. Ten percent is my upper limit for what I believe anyone should tolerate from all forms of government combined, and i'm paying 8 3/4 just for the Cit/State.AcesHigh wrote:americans complaining about taxes is always funny, considering how incredibly low taxes are in the US.Jccarlton wrote:I'm tired of feeling like a sucker. I'm tired of working hard, putting up with crazy bosses and having what I earn being eaten up by taxes so that I can pay for somebody else's lifestyle who make no contribution or actually does any work. Especially since I have to sacrifice and scrimp and deal with having bad credit because I save instead of spend.:
http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=70501
In addition to that I have State Income taxes, Federal Income taxes, Property Taxes, Tag Fees and penalties if I don't obey the state quickly enough in paying them for the privilege of tagging a vehicle i'm not driving anyway, Mandatory Insurance requirements, and i'm sure i've left out a few others.
Perhaps if you were PAYING taxes you might not think they were so low.
The Salient point in this discussion is "IT'S NOT THEIR MONEY!"
I do not exist to make the lives of bureaucrats and the parasite class easier. I am not a slave nor do I wish to be one.
Re: working For Two
Italian Company Taxation:AcesHigh wrote:americans complaining about taxes is always funny, considering how incredibly low taxes are in the US.Jccarlton wrote:I'm tired of feeling like a sucker. I'm tired of working hard, putting up with crazy bosses and having what I earn being eaten up by taxes so that I can pay for somebody else's lifestyle who make no contribution or actually does any work. Especially since I have to sacrifice and scrimp and deal with having bad credit because I save instead of spend.:
http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=70501
Company general Tax 33%
Company local tax 10%
Unrecoverable VAT on company expeses around 8% of expenses value.
Average total 2010 Tax for an Italian Company is 51%.
Profits to shareholders (if there is something left after paying company taxes) are taxed again at 27,5%.
Personal Income Tax.
a 50K US$ income pays 14K direct taxes.
a 100K US$ income pays 34K direct taxes.
On the top of that we have a 20% not recoverable VAT on the value of goods purchased, plus a plethora of local and regional taxes, property taxes and so on.
Average Personal Income Tax in 2010 was 39% on each saved $ and 63% on each spent $.
Taxwise America is not bad at all...
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rjaypeters
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I understand tax cheating in Italy is quite prevalent. Perhaps the above explains at least part of it.Giorgio wrote:Italian Company Taxation:
Company general Tax 33%
Company local tax 10%
Unrecoverable VAT on company expeses around 8% of expenses value.
Average total 2010 Tax for an Italian Company is 51%.
Profits to shareholders (if there is something left after paying company taxes) are taxed again at 27,5%.
"Aqaba! By Land!" T. E. Lawrence
R. Peters
R. Peters
If this is really so (I mean, if those numbers have not been manipulated) then you do have a problem in the US.
In "socialist" France, as some US citizens view it, this would not be the case. It is arguable that an unemployed family with children has the same available income as the same family with one minimal wage, which of course is stupid. Nevertheless a family making $60,000 a year will have much more available income. Consider a combination of two factors to explain that:
1 - The main tax in France, by far, is the 19.6% VAT, not the income tax which is way lower than what you have in the US. The VAT is paid in proportion to your spendings: the rich pay more in value but a lesser proportion of their income, since they spare more.
2 - Education is free for all and child benefit is paid equally, regardless of income.
IMHO, from an empirical standpoint, having more or less taxes, a small or large public sector is NOT the point. It is the efficiency of public/private spendings that is in question. Public spending efficiency has decreased spectacularly in France during the last 30 years through lack of investment and management creep. The efficiency of the private sector has decreased too. Too much financial window-dressing and short-mindedness. This is a general problem of leadership.
In "socialist" France, as some US citizens view it, this would not be the case. It is arguable that an unemployed family with children has the same available income as the same family with one minimal wage, which of course is stupid. Nevertheless a family making $60,000 a year will have much more available income. Consider a combination of two factors to explain that:
1 - The main tax in France, by far, is the 19.6% VAT, not the income tax which is way lower than what you have in the US. The VAT is paid in proportion to your spendings: the rich pay more in value but a lesser proportion of their income, since they spare more.
2 - Education is free for all and child benefit is paid equally, regardless of income.
IMHO, from an empirical standpoint, having more or less taxes, a small or large public sector is NOT the point. It is the efficiency of public/private spendings that is in question. Public spending efficiency has decreased spectacularly in France during the last 30 years through lack of investment and management creep. The efficiency of the private sector has decreased too. Too much financial window-dressing and short-mindedness. This is a general problem of leadership.
More than that is the public and political waste that is rampant here.rjaypeters wrote:I understand tax cheating in Italy is quite prevalent. Perhaps the above explains at least part of it.Giorgio wrote:Italian Company Taxation:
Company general Tax 33%
Company local tax 10%
Unrecoverable VAT on company expeses around 8% of expenses value.
Average total 2010 Tax for an Italian Company is 51%.
Profits to shareholders (if there is something left after paying company taxes) are taxed again at 27,5%.
Tax cheating is also an issue, but not as high as the government is trying to sell it.
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rjaypeters
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- Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2010 2:04 pm
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Oh, vicious circle to be sure.Giorgio wrote:More than that is the public and political waste that is rampant here.
Tax cheating is also an issue, but not as high as the government is trying to sell it.
Taxes not raising enough money? =>
Raise the rates =>
People don't report all the income =>
Taxes receipts down => repeat
Waste = incompetence + corruption + ? I don't envy the people of Italy. But I don't want to talk about things I read about from afar...
"Aqaba! By Land!" T. E. Lawrence
R. Peters
R. Peters
Something to make you cry:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y47jW2vf ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y47jW2vf ... re=related
Re: working For Two
I noticed from your chart that people in the 30k bracket have it the worst. This makes a huge disincentive for unemployed people or low income earners to improve themselves, unless they can make a jump to something well above the 60k mark.Jccarlton wrote:I'm tired of feeling like a sucker. I'm tired of working hard, putting up with crazy bosses and having what I earn being eaten up by taxes so that I can pay for somebody else's lifestyle who make no contribution or actually does any work. Especially since I have to sacrifice and scrimp and deal with having bad credit because I save instead of spend.:
http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=70501
CHoff