Manufacturing Poverty

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Jccarlton
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Post by Jccarlton »

MSimon wrote:
FREE MONEY!!!!! Roll the presses.
Kuchinich is old enough to know better. Or maybe he's having delusional episode. In any case, not only "NO", but "HELL NO."

Jccarlton
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Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2007 6:14 pm
Location: Southern Ct

Post by Jccarlton »

After all progressives are so much smarter that Conservatives:
http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/201 ... erior-man/
so much smarter that they are beyond having to deal with things like this:
http://www.thefreemanonline.org/columns ... mmodation/
Instead treating the world like a train set:
http://www.therightscoop.com/bill-whitt ... -all-evil/
Now I like model railroads, but in a model everthing can be understood discretely. Moving one figure, tree or building won't affect anything but the object at hand. In the real world, things are interconnected in ways that cannot be really understood even by the smartest among us. We can understand either small parts of the picture in great detail or the big picture with very little detail. Those little details don't go away and even if we don't see them they will still be important. That's why progressive models will always be failures. Here's one of the most elaborate train sets ever created to make the point:
http://www.horailroad.com/fsm/

MSimon
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Post by MSimon »

Jccarlton wrote:After all progressives are so much smarter that Conservatives:
http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/201 ... erior-man/
so much smarter that they are beyond having to deal with things like this:
http://www.thefreemanonline.org/columns ... mmodation/
Instead treating the world like a train set:
http://www.therightscoop.com/bill-whitt ... -all-evil/
Now I like model railroads, but in a model everthing can be understood discretely. Moving one figure, tree or building won't affect anything but the object at hand. In the real world, things are interconnected in ways that cannot be really understood even by the smartest among us. We can understand either small parts of the picture in great detail or the big picture with very little detail. Those little details don't go away and even if we don't see them they will still be important. That's why progressive models will always be failures. Here's one of the most elaborate train sets ever created to make the point:
http://www.horailroad.com/fsm/
It is a fractal world. Except the small bits are only roughly self similar.
Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.

choff
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Location: Vancouver, Canada

Post by choff »

Guernsey Island has been doing the exact same thing for the last 200 years and that's not theory but practice. They went from essentially bankrupt to solidly in the black with all public works up to spec., even with the big banks fighting every move they made.

http://solari.com/blog/guernsey-island- ... l-finance/
CHoff

Jccarlton
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Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2007 6:14 pm
Location: Southern Ct

Post by Jccarlton »

Consensii are fragile:
http://classicalvalues.com/2012/05/consensual/#comments
The big problem with progressives is that they only see "right now" and don't understand chaotic effects.
Also aristocrats and crony patronage don't work very well in a competitive environment:
http://pjmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2012/05/ ... enklatura/

choff
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Location: Vancouver, Canada

Post by choff »

One way to look at it, the Fed created $7.7 trillion to bail out the banks(Canadian included), on top of the $800 Billion bailout. All that money moving around the system didn't create one iota of inflation, but presumably fiat currency will.

In a fiat currency system inflation can be controlled by raising fractional reserve rates from the current nothing to as high as 100%.

It's not just Guernsey Island, from 1938 to 1974 Canada created money through a 100% publically owned central bank in a similar manner. The national debt was a flat $18 Billion for almost the entire time. The national debt only took flight after we stopped borrowing from the BoC and began borrowing at interest from private international banks, the debt currently sits at approx. $400 billion.

Regarding Von Mises, Hazlett, gold backed currency and the whole Austrian school. There is an old saying that if you can fool people into asking the wrong questions you don't have to worry about giving the right answers. These guys mostly ask the right questions but provide solutions that play right into the hands of central bankers.

If you dig into the history books, you will find that they were bankrolled by the very same guys who secretly drafted the federal reserve legislation on Jekyll Island, useful idiots, dezinformatzia.

Guernsey is to finance what Switzerland was to war. After the Swiss became democratically independent by military means, they hired themselves out as mercenaries to European Nobility suppressing peasants.
Guernsey beat the banks but now runs a busy offshore banking trade for nobility suppressing the peasants.
CHoff

MSimon
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Post by MSimon »

Choff,

Could you expound on this a little more? My knowledge base in the area is weak.
Regarding Von Mises, Hazlett, gold backed currency and the whole Austrian school. There is an old saying that if you can fool people into asking the wrong questions you don't have to worry about giving the right answers. These guys mostly ask the right questions but provide solutions that play right into the hands of central bankers.

If you dig into the history books, you will find that they were bankrolled by the very same guys who secretly drafted the federal reserve legislation on Jekyll Island, useful idiots, dezinformatzia.
Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.

JLawson
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Post by JLawson »

MSimon wrote:
FREE MONEY!!!!! Roll the presses.
His wife's hot. He, however, is not... and that includes the temperature of his brain.
When opinion and reality conflict - guess which one is going to win in the long run.

MSimon
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Post by MSimon »

JLawson wrote:
MSimon wrote:
FREE MONEY!!!!! Roll the presses.
His wife's hot. He, however, is not... and that includes the temperature of his brain.
The wife.

http://veganica.com/artist/photo.php?id=1806

Barely a "C" if that. My tastes run from large "C" to small "DD" - a handful. I have big hands - heh.
Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.

Diogenes
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Post by Diogenes »

Skipjack wrote:
By the way if you are Austrian how can you vote in US elections? Unless you are a service man posted overseas.
I cant, but my wife can (she is a US citizen). Sorry, should have been more careful in my wording. "I would not vote for Romney".
I'd not be surprised if Romney approximated the performance of G.W. Bush. Which while not really good, isn't driving full throttle towards a cliff.
You mean the GW Bush that gave us the economic crisis and made the US less popular than it has ever been before in the world?

This is just ignorance being repeated as knowledge. The fuel of the financial crises was mortgage defaults. Millions of people were unable to afford their mortgages.

Why? because the Government backed agencies of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mack had spent the last decade pushing mortgages to low income people who couldn't really afford them.

What group of people enacted these polices requiring Fannie Mae and Freddie Mack to get loans for people who couldn't afford the loans? Liberals who wanted to help low income people become homeowners; Bill Clinton, Barney Frank, John Kerry, Barack Obama, etc.

That is just another case where idiotic good intentions ended up as another disaster. (i.e. Lyndon Johnson's trillion dollar war on poverty.)


I am wasting my time trying to educate you on this or anything else. I do not believe you have any desire to actually understand historical reality and I think you are perfectly content to repeat crap about people you don't like anyway.
‘What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.’
— Lord Melbourne —

Diogenes
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Post by Diogenes »


Simon, that's not going to work on Skipjack. It has too many facts in it.
‘What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.’
— Lord Melbourne —

Diogenes
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Post by Diogenes »


I took a look. There was a warning label on the screen that said the report was created by an idiot and no one should bother looking at it. I didn't linger after that.

I think the exact word was "Kucinich."
‘What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.’
— Lord Melbourne —

Diogenes
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Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2009 3:33 pm

Post by Diogenes »

choff wrote:Guernsey Island has been doing the exact same thing for the last 200 years and that's not theory but practice. They went from essentially bankrupt to solidly in the black with all public works up to spec., even with the big banks fighting every move they made.

http://solari.com/blog/guernsey-island- ... l-finance/


Your link has very little elaboration on what exactly Guernsey Island did. If I read it correctly, they pretty much just printed money.

If this is indeed the case, then all we have to do to solve all the worlds problems is to print more money. Funny, this notion didn't seem to fair so well in the Weimar Republic or in Rhodesia.

Image

Image


There must be something missing in the explanation, because apparently the Weimar Republic and Rhodesia (among others) lacked the necessary magic ingredient.
‘What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.’
— Lord Melbourne —

kunkmiester
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Post by kunkmiester »

The problem with fiat money is that it has the same source of value as anything else--scarcity in comparison with the goods it trades for. Theoretically, you can use a fiat currency just fine as long as you limit the supply to match the actual economy. There's some leeway here you don't get otherwise but it must be watched carefully.

When Guernsey Island prints JUST enough money to pay for infrastructure that will actually exist, it meets this requirement--you're creating goods as well as money, so the supply doesn't actually inflate. The biggest problem with paying for social spending this way is that the money created doesn't actually create goods and services to match. This is where inflation runs away and causes problems. The tendency of politicians to do stuff like this is also one of the biggest criticisms of fiat money and central bank systems like the fed.
Evil is evil, no matter how small

Jccarlton
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Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2007 6:14 pm
Location: Southern Ct

Post by Jccarlton »

choff wrote:Regarding Von Mises, Hazlett, gold backed currency and the whole Austrian school. There is an old saying that if you can fool people into asking the wrong questions you don't have to worry about giving the right answers. These guys mostly ask the right questions but provide solutions that play right into the hands of central bankers.

If you dig into the history books, you will find that they were bankrolled by the very same guys who secretly drafted the federal reserve legislation on Jekyll Island, useful idiots, dezinformatzia.
Please explain, with references, ow a lifelong writer for various journals was "bankrolled" and by whom.:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Hazlitt
You know, the days when you could make claims and not be fact checked are sort of over. I don't know if you are just spouting something you heard or just making stuff up, but it's just too easy to check to get away with it.

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