Space X to build reusable launch vehicle

[krenshala]

Is Commercial Space Transportation reaching a tipping Point?
http://nextbigfuture.com/2012/02/is-com ... ation.html

I think that Obama may be doing the wrong thing (cutting space or at least flat funding) for the wrong reason (because he doesn't give a rip about space) but accidently in spite of himself may help usher end a space renaissance

The space industry is one of those industries that should probably be privatized with a regulating body (NASA).

Thankfully this is also a time when folks with the desire, the money, and (access to) the required knowledge are working to get space access commercialized/privatized.

The longer they take, the less likely I am to make it off this rock alive.

[KitemanSA]

krenshala,
In your "location" you are missing
Sol, Milky Way, Local Group, Virgo Supercluster.

[kunkmiester]

A regulating body for spaceflight should have no conflicting interests. Since NASA is working to develop it's own lift capabilities, it needs to either end those(like NACA was ended), or another body(FAA maybe?) should be given the authority, to eliminate conflict of interest.

[hanelyp]

The FAA would be a strong candidate for regulating space launch if the field were mature. But until the field has a chance to mature it needs vastly different regulation than the airliner style rules I'd expect the FAA to apply.

[Aero]

The FAA would be a strong candidate for regulating space launch if the field were mature. But until the field has a chance to mature it needs vastly different regulation than the airliner style rules I'd expect the FAA to apply.

You win. The Office of Commercial Space Transportation (AST). Its been in business for 27 years.

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/hea ... ast/about/

Read all about it!

[Skipjack]

NASA should be the client, not the regulator. Making the client the regulator does not make sense. IMHO other than exploration and science missions, NASA should be focusing on developing new technologies and high risk high gain research projects that private companies wont touch. Then they should license that technology to private companies that can use it to provide services to NASA and commercial clients. A good example how something like this can work is PICA the heatshield tech that NASA developed for Apollo and PICAX, the derivate technology that SpaceX made based on that for Dragon (which will be reusable 100 times or so).
The SLS is unfortunately preventing NASA from doing just that. The money for this abomination is missing elsewhere, especially in the research sector. I just hope that congress wont cut commercial crew again in their "cut spending" craze (which for some reason does not seem to apply to defense and security crap).

[kunkmiester]

NASA needs to contract out access to orbit, buying rockets to put their payloads in orbit, taking bids just like everyone else. Let the market work out the best way to put their astronauts and extraterrestrial missions into orbit, and going from there.

The DOD doesn't make it's own airplanes, and for airlift, the closest analogue, they use large amounts of contract flights on commercial planes to move cargo, saving the military planes for sensitive, or dangerous missions/loads. NASA should do the same, hiring flights on systems like the Falcon/Dragon where possible, and placing bids for the development of a heavy lifter. If the SLS will save money, then ATK and the others involved should have no problem making it happen quickly and efficiently and underbidding SpaceX and such.

[ladajo]

and for airlift, the closest analogue, they use large amounts of contract flights on commercial planes to move cargo, saving the military planes for sensitive, or dangerous missions/loads.

Uhhh....no.

The DOD maintains and operates the largest logistics entity on the planet. This includes air, surface, and sea modals. It also includes the ability to reach into commercial industry and activate standing contracts, the civil reserve fleet, or just some adhock lifts.

I take it you are somewhat unfamliar with what you actually speak of here. The lift capacity of the DOD is one of the Centers of Gravity in why the US Military is the Pre-Eminent Military Force in the history of the world. A position that is far and away ahead of second place.

You shold review your knowledge of USNS Platforms, Active and Reserve Force Air Logisitics platforms, the Civilian Air Reserve Fleet, The Maritime Reserve Fleet, etc, etc, blah blah.

Yes, DOD does contract cargo. But it is not by any means the primary mode of lift.

[KitemanSA]

Yes, DOD does contract cargo. But it is not by any means the primary mode of lift.

Be careful. If you seperate the Military and the Civilian DOD, the civilian part does in fact use civilian (commercial) assets almost exclusively. The MILITARY however...

[Skipjack]

They need to have several bidders too, not just one. Otherwise you end up with a monopoly. Also, in case one bidder is grounded due to investigation into some issues, the other bidder could still fly (provided the system is different enough so that there is no overlap). Otherwise you can end up with a situation similar to when the shuttle was grounded for many months after an accident. With multiple bidders this is much less likely. Of course this will only be possible if the morons in Washington dont decide to cut the funding for Commercial Crew even more to feed it to one of their favorite pork projects that are already costing multiple billions...

[ladajo]

Yes, DOD does contract cargo. But it is not by any means the primary mode of lift.

Be careful. If you seperate the Military and the Civilian DOD, the civilian part does in fact use civilian (commercial) assets almost exclusively. The MILITARY however...

I think ownership of the equipment is the baseline. Is it Public Property or not?

But, to be fair, I did say that there is contract cargo. But Public Property lift capacity is massive (and ongoing in use).

[kunkmiester]

NASA would buy a Falcon 9 much like the DOD buys C-17s. They'd also send astronauts up on a contract flight much like I used a civilian airliner to fly to Germany when assigned there(Air Force). IIRC the plane that TDYed us from New Mexico to Vegas for Red Flag was airline owned, though contracted exclusively for the flight. That or it was a KC, I can't remember exactly now.

In the end, it was easier to get an airline to take me from Texas to Germany, rather than bother with coordinating a military plane to do it. For probes and such NASA might prefer to control the assets, but it doesn't dilute my point that much.

If NASA decides its launchers need something special, fine, but they should be buying them the way the DOD buys airlifters--put out needs, take bids, etc. It kind of does this now, but it's way too convoluted and somewhat monopolistic, as many here who know better have explained better.

[ladajo]

The other rub in this is that the current directives state that if space hardware touches government space hardware or bodies in flight, it must be NASA certed. I was told this by the Safety Director for Kennedy.

[krenshala]

I can see the need for NASA to certify hardware that is going to be interacting with their equipment/personnel. After all, they have to go through a mountain of red tape just to get to that point, and probably don't want to have to do it again just because something turned out to not be up to the specifications they needed.

Do they overdo it? Probably.

krenshala,
In your "location" you are missing
Sol, Milky Way, Local Group, Virgo Supercluster.

Actually, it would be -- Austin, TX, NorAm, Sol III, Orion–Cygnus Arm, Milky Way, Local Group, Virgo Supercluster. I leave off everything after the stellar system since few on this planet seem to care about the rest of the address.

[KitemanSA]

krenshala,
In your "location" you are missing
Sol, Milky Way, Local Group, Virgo Supercluster.

Actually, it would be -- Austin, TX, NorAm, Sol III, Orion–Cygnus Arm, Milky Way, Local Group, Virgo Supercluster. I leave off everything after the stellar system since few on this planet seem to care about the rest of the address.

Austin, TX, NorAm, Terra, Sol, Orion–Cygnus Arm, Milky Way, Local Group, Virgo Supercluster. But only if you want to be excessive and use the neighborhood of the OCArm rather than just going for the whole MW enchilada.