Yes, The Money Has Run Out

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MSimon
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Postby MSimon » Wed May 05, 2010 4:22 pm

choff wrote:The problem is with offshore banking, it's getting bigger than onshore banking, has no reserve requirements, no checks and balances, and is governed by secrecy. Onshore banks can lend to each other knowing what each bank has as collateral. But offshore banks can't tell if they're solvent or not when they borrow and lend. If their's a run on offshore banks it can't be managed. Plus, the tax dodger's are usually the wealthy, leaving the little people to make up the difference.


Well yeah. And smuggling is a poor way to compensate for high duties. But it is a way.

And you are telling me that overtaxing the wealthy is counterproductive? You are expecting that water is not wet as well?
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MSimon
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Postby MSimon » Wed May 05, 2010 4:25 pm

choff wrote:I forgot to mention, that with secrecy and non-disclosure, electronic money transfers between offshore banks can easily make the logical progression from real currency to virtual to imaginary.


Most "money" is imaginary these days. I'm even legally entitled to print my own in varying denominations. Checking accounts. Of course (other than float) my reserve requirement is 100%.
Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.
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THE OPEN POLYWELL FUSION CONSORTIUM

choff
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Postby choff » Thu May 06, 2010 1:09 am

Unfortunately, when the banksters have imaginary money problems, the world has a real recession with real unemployment.
CHoff

Diogenes
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Postby Diogenes » Mon May 10, 2010 7:51 pm

Sometimes a picture is worth a thousand words.


Image

choff
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Postby choff » Tue May 11, 2010 2:30 am

Read this on the weekend.

http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/Putt ... story.html

I see one or two ways the EU can get out of this mess. Go with the bailout provisions for 2 or 3 years until hopefully the global economy is back in black, then writeoff/writedown a sizeable chunk of the debt load, so that the remainder can be paid off long term.
The other is for the other EU countries to transplant highly profitable industrial operations to Greece, ( at the expense of high paying jobs in France and Germany)!
Some combination of the 2 might work, otherwise, the average Greek is very sensible in saying default, since the longer they wait, the bigger the debt will be when they do, and hence bigger the impact on the financial markets. They have to wait until nobody has the jitters first.
From the sound of it, the Greek economy will get crushed by the bailout provisions.
CHoff

Jccarlton
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Postby Jccarlton » Thu May 13, 2010 10:30 am

choff wrote:Read this on the weekend.

http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/Putt ... story.html

I see one or two ways the EU can get out of this mess. Go with the bailout provisions for 2 or 3 years until hopefully the global economy is back in black, then writeoff/writedown a sizeable chunk of the debt load, so that the remainder can be paid off long term.
The other is for the other EU countries to transplant highly profitable industrial operations to Greece, ( at the expense of high paying jobs in France and Germany)!
Some combination of the 2 might work, otherwise, the average Greek is very sensible in saying default, since the longer they wait, the bigger the debt will be when they do, and hence bigger the impact on the financial markets. They have to wait until nobody has the jitters first.
From the sound of it, the Greek economy will get crushed by the bailout provisions.

In either case the Greek Gov't has to stop spending money it does not have or it's pointless. Every gov't needs to look at this and stop spending.

Jccarlton
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Postby Jccarlton » Thu May 13, 2010 10:33 am

I and Glenn Beck are not the only ones saying that there isn't any money anymore:
http://www.dailymarkets.com/stocks/2010 ... o-clothes/

The sooner we admit to ourselves that the status quo is unsustainable and that real deep cuts need to be made in the entitlement programs the softer the crash will be. But at this point it will still be a crash.

MSimon
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Postby MSimon » Thu May 13, 2010 4:11 pm

choff wrote:Read this on the weekend.

http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/Putt ... story.html

I see one or two ways the EU can get out of this mess. Go with the bailout provisions for 2 or 3 years until hopefully the global economy is back in black, then writeoff/writedown a sizeable chunk of the debt load, so that the remainder can be paid off long term.
The other is for the other EU countries to transplant highly profitable industrial operations to Greece, ( at the expense of high paying jobs in France and Germany)!
Some combination of the 2 might work, otherwise, the average Greek is very sensible in saying default, since the longer they wait, the bigger the debt will be when they do, and hence bigger the impact on the financial markets. They have to wait until nobody has the jitters first.
From the sound of it, the Greek economy will get crushed by the bailout provisions.


The Greeks have already crushed their economy. The bailout provisions are not a cause - they are an effect. i.e. when the credit counselor says you have to reduce your expenses to make ends meet and pay down your debt it is not the counselor's fault that he has to advise harsh measures.

Is the world economy really on the mend? I don't think so.

http://powerandcontrol.blogspot.com/201 ... check.html
Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.
http://protonboron.com/
THE OPEN POLYWELL FUSION CONSORTIUM

olivier
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Postby olivier » Thu May 13, 2010 4:34 pm

MSimon wrote:The Greeks have already crushed their economy.
I think you got it right. Hopefully, The Greeks also have an underground economy. On the one hand, this is probably a reason why the other economy crushed but, on the other hand, that will probably help them in tough times. Strange.

The initial problem is a small country being unable to refund a not so big loan.
The proposed solution is bigger countries joining together to raise a much bigger loan to guarantee the Greek loan.
Is anybody there versed enough in Economics to foresee the next step?

MSimon
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Postby MSimon » Thu May 13, 2010 4:48 pm

olivier wrote:
MSimon wrote:The Greeks have already crushed their economy.
I think you got it right. Hopefully, The Greeks also have an underground economy. On the one hand, this is probably a reason why the other economy crushed but, on the other hand, that will probably help them in tough times. Strange.

The initial problem is a small country being unable to refund a not so big loan.
The proposed solution is bigger countries joining together to raise a much bigger loan to guarantee the Greek loan.
Is anybody there versed enough in Economics to foresee the next step?


Tough question. Because it is not microeconomics. It is macro. And macro includes politics. And the German people and French people are not happy paying for their wastrel brother-in-law.

The Greek government may not be the only one to fall over this.
Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.
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THE OPEN POLYWELL FUSION CONSORTIUM

MSimon
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Postby MSimon » Thu May 13, 2010 4:53 pm

Let me add that I have seen reports that the Japanese Government may go into default in 2 to 5 years. Their cash reserves will be gone in 2 years. After that it is just a matter of time.

China has a HUGE property bubble just waiting to burst. It was not a problem as long as the rest of the world had enough money to buy their goods.
Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.
http://protonboron.com/
THE OPEN POLYWELL FUSION CONSORTIUM

choff
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Postby choff » Fri May 14, 2010 4:46 am

I listened to one report that claimed if it wasn't for illicit drug money the banks would have run out of capital 2 years ago.

The problem with creating a bailout scheme for Greece is that if all it does is put the country deeper in debt in perpetuity, the Greek voters will replace the government with one committed to defaulting. For a bailout to work the Greek voters have got to be able to see light at the end of the tunnel, (and not from an oncoming train)!

In essence, the scheme has to steadily reduce the debt down to some reasonable level. If it doesn't, defaulting at this level is a lot less painful that defaulting on twice as much down the road, though it's like the difference between being hit by an A bomb as opposed to an H bomb.

They do have a robust underground ecomony, 30% of total GNP, much like the other South European countries with debt problems.

I can understand the arguement that common regulations for a transparent international banking system are bad, because if the books were open people would realize just how bad the situation is. Most offshore banks couldn't come up to spec's without collapsing, and seeing the books would scare money away from them, killing them and bringing the whole 400 year old Ponzi scam down.

If the system recovers down the road, I still believe common regulations on offshore banking are needed to prevent another recession.
CHoff

MSimon
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Postby MSimon » Fri May 14, 2010 5:25 am

I listened to one report that claimed if it wasn't for illicit drug money the banks would have run out of capital 2 years ago.


I have written a number of posts on that subject. One of the earliest was in 2003. Here is a repost of that 2003 article:

http://powerandcontrol.blogspot.com/200 ... ition.html

and this link from the post:

http://www.narconews.com/narcodollars1.html

There are two more links in the article.

Another from Jan. 2009:

http://powerandcontrol.blogspot.com/200 ... -cash.html
Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.
http://protonboron.com/
THE OPEN POLYWELL FUSION CONSORTIUM

MSimon
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Postby MSimon » Fri May 14, 2010 5:28 am

If the system recovers down the road, I still believe common regulations on offshore banking are needed to prevent another recession.


Offshore banking is a symptom. In that respect they are very valuable.
Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.
http://protonboron.com/
THE OPEN POLYWELL FUSION CONSORTIUM

MSimon
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Postby MSimon » Fri May 14, 2010 6:34 am

Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.
http://protonboron.com/
THE OPEN POLYWELL FUSION CONSORTIUM


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