Green Solutions Go Astray Again

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GIThruster
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Green Solutions Go Astray Again

Post by GIThruster »

Not funny, and the trouble with the wind turbines was at least this bad.

http://www.ijreview.com/2014/08/169205- ... s-mid-air/
"Courage is not just a virtue, but the form of every virtue at the testing point." C. S. Lewis

paperburn1
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Re: Green Solutions Go Astray Again

Post by paperburn1 »

I think this article may be suspect, It suggest that the birds are drawn to the insects coming to the light. Just like the light on your porch draws in bugs. But only the birds are getting fried and the insect population remains steady around the worlds largest bug zapper. :lol:
Not saying its not happening but the real numbers of bird carcasses found would be nice to know.
I am not a nuclear physicist, but play one on the internet.

GIThruster
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Re: Green Solutions Go Astray Again

Post by GIThruster »

Agreed. IJReview is not prone however to shoddy reporting and misrepresentation. They did for example cite the source for the 28,000 bird/year estimate. If its 1/10 that its still a lot. In any case, I think its helpful we always look for hidden costs in such programs.
Last edited by GIThruster on Thu Aug 21, 2014 2:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Courage is not just a virtue, but the form of every virtue at the testing point." C. S. Lewis

MSimon
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Re: Green Solutions Go Astray Again

Post by MSimon »

Roasted turkeys? Oh. Wait. Turkeys can't fly.

http://youtu.be/lf3mgmEdfwg
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Diogenes
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Re: Green Solutions Go Astray Again

Post by Diogenes »

Image
‘What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.’
— Lord Melbourne —

tomclarke
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Re: Green Solutions Go Astray Again

Post by tomclarke »

So, reading the reports:

Federal officials have estimated one every 2 min (you can bet that was a throw-away remark made by one official). Another (more serious) estimate was 28,000 per year from the bird people. The solar plant people estimate 1000 per years. So I'd put the true number somewhere between those two estimates, but closer to the 28K/year one probably.

Now... In the US between 300,000,000 and 900,000,000 birds are estimated to die each year flying into windows (mostly normal house windows).

So the cost of solar power does not seem so high unless you are a bird greenie.

And this story looks designed to appeal to those who have some ulterior dislike of green energy.

As with animals killed on roads, if the deaths are significant you will get some fast natural selection for less risky behaviours over a number of years. So that will help. But the numbers do not look alarming given that there are not going to be a large number of these concentrated solar plants.

The other thing to note is that birds adjust populations according to predation and habitat. So culling a given number per year is not likely very significant - there are feedbacks.

MSimon
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Re: Green Solutions Go Astray Again

Post by MSimon »

And this story looks designed to appeal to those who have some ulterior dislike of green energy.
Green energy does have value. It is driving business out of California.
Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.

GIThruster
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Re: Green Solutions Go Astray Again

Post by GIThruster »

tomclarke wrote:Now... In the US between 300,000,000 and 900,000,000 birds are estimated to die each year flying into windows (mostly normal house windows).
That does help put this into perspective. This does seem high, but I wondered what windows do over time so I guess I'm not too surprised. I had a bird fly right into my car the other day and I had a hard time getting him back out.
"Courage is not just a virtue, but the form of every virtue at the testing point." C. S. Lewis

CherryPick
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Re: Green Solutions Go Astray Again

Post by CherryPick »

paperburn1 wrote:I think this article may be suspect, It suggest that the birds are drawn to the insects coming to the light. Just like the light on your porch draws in bugs. But only the birds are getting fried and the insect population remains steady around the worlds largest bug zapper. :lol:
Not saying its not happening but the real numbers of bird carcasses found would be nice to know.

This is green news. :mrgreen: A lot of feelings, facts are not shown maybe because there are no facts or they do not support the news. Just like polar bears - so cute that readers believe that they eat just baby seals.

This article at least tries to show some quantitative figures which is typical to skeptics.
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