Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

Discuss life, the universe, and everything with other members of this site. Get to know your fellow polywell enthusiasts.

Moderators: tonybarry, MSimon

Skipjack
Posts: 6051
Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 2:29 pm
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1236: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

Postby Skipjack » Thu Feb 13, 2014 3:00 pm

No problem with having a few trained, armed people at the school. That is different from arming the teachers.
That "liberal society" with very few people armed works quite well in central and northern Europe, which is much safer than the US. Having everyone run around arresting other people without protocol and oversight will soon result in rival factions going after each other trying to "protect" their turf. Remember that the mafia started out as a kind of private police replacement.

ladajo
Posts: 6204
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 11:18 pm
Location: North East Coast
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1236: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

Postby ladajo » Thu Feb 13, 2014 5:04 pm

The development of atomic power, though it could confer unimaginable blessings on mankind, is something that is dreaded by the owners of coal mines and oil wells. (Hazlitt)
What I want to do is to look up C. . . . I call him the Forgotten Man. (Sumner)

ladajo
Posts: 6204
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 11:18 pm
Location: North East Coast
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1236: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

Postby ladajo » Thu Feb 13, 2014 5:23 pm

The point is that folks don't go around looking to arrest each other.
Although, if someone commits a crime in fornt of others, I would hope they intervene and seek to hold the perps until they can turn them over to the system for processing.

If citizens do not take personal responsibility for the society they live in it is doomed to fail.
Just as much as if they abrogate all responsibility to the "governing".

Socities of the people, by the people, and for the people are the only ones that will last and be just.

When you weaken or remove any leg of that triangle, the system will fail.

As for having armed folks in the school. I am all for it. I have not problem with a teacher, secretary or janitor being armed as long as they have shown and continue to show they are responsible enough and skilled enough to provide use of force services in protection of there place of work. If they want to do it, then I am all for it. I encourage them.

School shootings will have no chance of stopping as long as idiots think that the schools are undefended. And the public school system does not have enough money as is to support education, so asking for them to buy and service more staff (and the career that goes with it) is silly. Leverage the resources in place at much smaller cost.

You are making a mountain out of a mole hill.

Ask for volunteers. Protect their identities. Screen them. Train & Cert them, advertise they exist, and let them do the job.
What do you think the odds are that a school that does this and posts signs and spread the word that they have is going to be attacked? Pretty much ZERO I think. And if they are attacked, it is not going to be in a killing spree format. It will be a one off, and probably a sucker kill by an angry disturbed person who then offs themselves.
The development of atomic power, though it could confer unimaginable blessings on mankind, is something that is dreaded by the owners of coal mines and oil wells. (Hazlitt)

What I want to do is to look up C. . . . I call him the Forgotten Man. (Sumner)

ladajo
Posts: 6204
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 11:18 pm
Location: North East Coast
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1236: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

Postby ladajo » Thu Feb 13, 2014 5:25 pm

As far as Active Shooter response goes, it is very straight forward doctrine to follow.

I. Get out.
2. If you can't get out, then shelter in place.
3. If you can't wait it out in shelter (ie nutjob coming in your space), then be prepared to try and take him/her down. Ambush them with whatever/whoever you can immediately upon entry.

It is proven that once attacked, the shooters quickly go to failure mode. Even if they succeed in defeating the initial attack by victims. Being counter-attacked completely changes their pyschological perception of the situation and event, and leads them rapidly to an event ending. Usually where they cap themselves in corner somewhere. This phenomena is driven by the fact that they transition from thinking they are in control to not. The normative driver for a shooter is a seeking of control. Once they see that it is in doubt, the entire facade crumbles. That is also why they avoid conciously or unconciously protected persons or areas.

Police are not responding to rescue at the outset. They are actively seeking the shooter(s). They will not stop and assist victims until they have jammed up the shooter(s), and can free up assets to start evacs. I am also sure that the police are not "locking them in". They are more than likely telling them to shelter as the situation is still in flux, and an evac lane is not established.

I have been on both sides of this equation professionally. It really is common sense and straight forward with no silly conspiracy kookiness about "conditioning the population".

Get real.
The development of atomic power, though it could confer unimaginable blessings on mankind, is something that is dreaded by the owners of coal mines and oil wells. (Hazlitt)

What I want to do is to look up C. . . . I call him the Forgotten Man. (Sumner)

Skipjack
Posts: 6051
Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 2:29 pm
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1236: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

Postby Skipjack » Thu Feb 13, 2014 5:29 pm


ladajo
Posts: 6204
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 11:18 pm
Location: North East Coast
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1236: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

Postby ladajo » Thu Feb 13, 2014 5:32 pm

Let's talk context.

How many major cities does Austria have compared to the US?

How many comparable major cities does the EU have compared to the US?

Does this ratio skew your interpretaion of "murder rates"?
The development of atomic power, though it could confer unimaginable blessings on mankind, is something that is dreaded by the owners of coal mines and oil wells. (Hazlitt)

What I want to do is to look up C. . . . I call him the Forgotten Man. (Sumner)

williatw
Posts: 1862
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2009 7:15 pm
Location: Ohio
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1236: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

Postby williatw » Thu Feb 13, 2014 6:21 pm

Last edited by williatw on Fri Feb 14, 2014 6:01 am, edited 1 time in total.

paperburn1
Posts: 2457
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2009 5:53 am
Location: Third rock from the sun.
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1236: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

Postby paperburn1 » Thu Feb 13, 2014 6:53 pm

However, when looking only at the rate of people assaulted or mugged, the United States had a lower rate than any country except Canada and Japan, according to the same OECD index.
and again I am bringing up my pet theory that murder rate follows city size and percentage of poverty level.
There is only 130 city's in Europe with populations above 250000.
over 140 just for the USA
so after normalizing the data the USA is only slightly higher risk of homicide but a less risk of violent crime.
But France and Austria for some reason is a statistical anomaly compared to the rest of Europe with very low murder / violent crimes
I find that very interesting why crime is so low in those two areas compared to the rest of the EU. They stand out by being 75% less likely to be injured in crime than the rest of the USA/EU. This puts them as a very safe place to be but the surrounding country are not.
Maybe we should be looking at how they are doing business.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... icide_rate
I am not a nuclear physicist, but play one on the internet.

Skipjack
Posts: 6051
Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 2:29 pm
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1236: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

Postby Skipjack » Thu Feb 13, 2014 7:17 pm


paperburn1
Posts: 2457
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2009 5:53 am
Location: Third rock from the sun.
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1236: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

Postby paperburn1 » Thu Feb 13, 2014 7:39 pm

link was at the bottom of my post and it did show France and Austria way below the USA and most of Europe.
Scroll down and you can sort by country ,
By the way it also agrees with your original assertion that France and Austria are safer.
I am not a nuclear physicist, but play one on the internet.

ladajo
Posts: 6204
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 11:18 pm
Location: North East Coast
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1236: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

Postby ladajo » Thu Feb 13, 2014 7:48 pm

The development of atomic power, though it could confer unimaginable blessings on mankind, is something that is dreaded by the owners of coal mines and oil wells. (Hazlitt)

What I want to do is to look up C. . . . I call him the Forgotten Man. (Sumner)

Skipjack
Posts: 6051
Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 2:29 pm
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1236: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

Postby Skipjack » Thu Feb 13, 2014 7:53 pm


williatw
Posts: 1862
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2009 7:15 pm
Location: Ohio
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1236: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

Postby williatw » Thu Feb 13, 2014 11:01 pm

Last edited by williatw on Fri Feb 14, 2014 2:01 am, edited 1 time in total.

GIThruster
Posts: 4686
Joined: Tue May 25, 2010 8:17 pm
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1236: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

Postby GIThruster » Thu Feb 13, 2014 11:57 pm

"Courage is not just a virtue, but the form of every virtue at the testing point." C. S. Lewis

Diogenes
Posts: 6958
Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2009 3:33 pm
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1236: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

Postby Diogenes » Fri Feb 14, 2014 12:17 am

‘What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.’
— Lord Melbourne —


[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1236: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Return to “General”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests