Evil? Now, perhaps. Later? Not so much.

[AcesHigh]

pedophiles may argue all they want. Its not up to them. The only argument here is AGE OF CONSENT. That definition will mostly come from psychologists and the like. They may very well lower them, but never will lower it enough to please pedophiles, because pedophiles want children if possible, and psychologists would probably, in CERTAIN cases, lower consent age above the pre-teens, but never lower than that.

[ScottL]

There are several papers by researchers in the field of biological maturity including mental maturity. This is the issue being ignored. The age of consent starts at roughly the age of biological mental maturity, of course that's an estimated age which varies per individual, but it's a reasonable age line. Consent would therefore still be a valid measure for preventing pedophilia while allowing for homosexuality. It's backed by many years of research and has a scientific basis.

[Diogenes]

There is a huge difference between two consenting adults of the same sexual orientation and an adult and a child that has no chance of consenting and is never asked for its consent anyway and that does definitely not share the sexual orientation with the sexual predator.

In 50 years you will be called a "pedophobe" and possibly prosecuted for a hate crime for saying such a thing.

blah blah blah... more stupid nonsense from the very same Diogenes.

really Diogenes, when will you start saying here that evolution is just a theory and that the Earth is 6000 years old???

you quote an article from a religious site, so really is some Bible passages to you:

And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, Avenge the children of Israel of the Midianites ... And they warred against the Midianites, as the LORD commanded Moses; and they slew all the males ... And the children of Israel took all the women of Midian captives, and their little ones ... And Moses was wroth with the officers ... And Moses said unto them, Have ye saved all the women alive? ... Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves. Numbers 31:1-18
When thou comest nigh unto a city to fight against it ... And when the LORD thy God hath delivered it into thine hands, thou shalt smite every male thereof with the edge of the sword: But the women, and the little ones, and the cattle, and all that is in the city, even all the spoil thereof, shalt thou take unto thyself. Deuteronomy 20:10-14
How shall we do for wives for them that remain, seeing we have sworn by the LORD that we will not give them of our daughters to wives? ... And the congregation sent thither twelve thousand men of the valiantest, and commanded them, saying, Go and smite the inhabitants of Jabeshgilead with the edge of the sword, with the women and the children. And this is the thing that ye shall do, Ye shall utterly destroy every male, and every woman that hath lain by man. And they found among the inhabitants of Jabeshgilead four hundred young virgins, that had known no man by lying with any male: and they brought them unto the camp to Shiloh. Judges 21:7-11
Go and lie in wait in the vineyards; And see, and, behold, if the daughters of Shiloh come out to dance in dances, then come ye out of the vineyards, and catch you every man his wife of the daughters of Shiloh ... And the children of Benjamin did so, and took them wives, according to their number, of them that danced, whom they caught. Judges 21:20-23

It's OK to sell your daughter (no mention is made of age) to a man for him to use as a sex slave.

if a man sell his daughter to be a maidservant ... If she please not her master, who hath betrothed her to himself, then shall he let her be redeemed ... If he take him another wife; her food, her raiment, and her duty of marriage, shall he not diminish. Exodus 21:7-10

Your vehemence would suggest I struck some sort of nerve. This usually indicates that you see yourself in this topic. I suspect you would fall in the immature child category rather than that of the pedophile. You are a nuisance and not capable of a coherent argument in my recollection. I mostly don't read your crap because It makes me feel as though I am gaining dumbness vicariously through you.

[Diogenes]

I think the root of all this falls into the realm of the more powerful taking advantage of the weaker. Be it whomever the targeted victim, it should be fundamental that it is wrong for anyone to use an advantage be it physical/mental/positional to coerce another person(s) into acts they would not think of doing on their own. As I recall, the operative word would be respect. Why over complicate the whole thing?

I think you are overlooking the point. Many argue "consent" but do not consider what happens when there is no coercion, and therefore when consent is given. Then people say "legal consent" and that is exactly what this group wishes to change.

I merely point out that the forces of the left have already done this before. With enough media conditioning, our elite socialites will eventually adopt the morals of Caligula (seems to have already happened in Hollywood) and call them normal, and anyone that objects will be mocked and maligned, and possibly accused of a "hate crime."

lets not mention that men marrying and having sex with girls as soon as they had their first blood was an habit that kept on at very religious europe until at least the 17th century...

it was illuminism, not religion, that created new definitions of "age of consent", etc.


left to religion alone, men would still be marrying 13 year old girls, and killing adult homosexuals.

Without religion, idiots would be killed or enslaved. That would not bode well for you.

[ScottL]

Without religion, idiots would be killed or enslaved. That would not bode well for you.

Aren't the uneducated and even the educated already tied into another form of slavery? We live in a tier system and then get told not to yell when we're unhappy with our teir (class warfare).

[Diogenes]

Sorry Diogenes, but I dont know anybody in their right mind, not even nutjobs from the far left, that would want to give pedophiles legal status.
This is absolutely ridiculous to assume. Again there is a huge difference between two consenting adults and an adult and a child that is in no way able to give consent or that often is not even old enough to understand the implications.
Pedophiles are sick, they have mental defect, most likely caused by a gene mutation. It is a form of psychopathy. They should be kept away from society. They can not be integrated into society, no matter how you try.
Just like a child can not give legal consent to getting certain surgery done, or is not allowed to vote, it can not give consent to having sex with an adult. It does not work and I dont think that anyone can spin this in any way. It has NOTHING in common with homosexuals who are two consenting adults.

You have no idea how amusing it is to read your reasoning, because it exactly reflects the same things said back in the 50s,60s,70s. Homosexuals were considered mentally ill, Homosexuals were not able to give legal consent because they were regarded by the law as "Non compos mentis."

They changed the law regarding consent for homosexuals. They are working to change the law regarding consent for younger persons.

If they can move Abortion up to the fourth tri-mester, I don't see why they can't move consent in the other direction.

[Diogenes]

pedophiles may argue all they want. Its not up to them. The only argument here is AGE OF CONSENT. That definition will mostly come from psychologists and the like. They may very well lower them, but never will lower it enough to please pedophiles, because pedophiles want children if possible, and psychologists would probably, in CERTAIN cases, lower consent age above the pre-teens, but never lower than that.

No, that will NEVER happen. Sheesh.

[Diogenes]

There are several papers by researchers in the field of biological maturity including mental maturity. This is the issue being ignored. The age of consent starts at roughly the age of biological mental maturity, of course that's an estimated age which varies per individual, but it's a reasonable age line. Consent would therefore still be a valid measure for preventing pedophilia while allowing for homosexuality. It's backed by many years of research and has a scientific basis.

Kinsey supposedly had a scientific basis for his research into Sexuality and Homosexuality. We find out years later that he used skewed samples and fudged much of his work to support his own abnormal preferences.

Rest assured, when a "Scientific Study" needs to be produced to justify what the pedophiles want, they will get one tailor made that supports their position. I seem to recall reading articles in the past that suggest such "studies" have already been done. As a matter of fact, It appears Alfred Kinsey did such a study. I would port the data over here but it is all text as opposed to an image. Click on the link to See Alfred Kinsey's sexuality research data on Children as young as 5 months old.

This study was done in 1948. Read the article.

Despite the common sense fact of low rates of illegitimacy and VD, despite personal knowledge of faithful and virtuous family and friends, mainstream America was dramatically shaken by Kinsey's data. The popular press hawked Kinsey as a diversion from Truman's ominous cold-war warnings, heralding the astonishing scientific findings-that 98% of men and roughly half of women had premarital sex, 95% of American men were legally sex offenders and 10% or more of men were largely homosexual. And, while no one noted that 317 infants and children were "tested" for Kinsey's child sex data, educators repeated his conclusions-that children were sexual from birth, hence school sex education, Kinsey style, should be mandated.

[Diogenes]

Without religion, idiots would be killed or enslaved. That would not bode well for you.

Aren't the uneducated and even the educated already tied into another form of slavery? We live in a tier system and then get told not to yell when we're unhappy with our teir (class warfare).

Social stratification is an inherent human trait. We instinctively and biologically respond to Alpha males, and we all vie for position in the social status pecking order. If you haven't read it, read this book. It gets it's conclusions right, but it's reasoning is a little weak, but an intelligent person can see past the weak reasoning into better reasoning.

NOT RECOMMENDED FOR THOSE WITH RELIGIOUS BELIEFS.



What people nowadays don't realize is that it was Christianity which swayed humanity to the (for humans) unnatural principle of equality between people. Christianity argues that we are all equal in the eyes of God, and therefore should be equal in the eyes of man's law which is subservient to God's law. It was the Christian religions nut-jobs that outlawed and abolished slavery in most of the world.

Civilization is created by getting people to suppress their natural instincts that are destructive to the group. (Primal urges) The only thing that works well in accomplishing this is fear. Fear of punishment from an omniscient and omnipotent God.

Religion may be a racket and nonsense, but it is a very beneficial and successful type of racket and nonsense.

[Skipjack]

Oh dear. This is pointless.
Diogenes, dont you get it?
Homosexuals: two consenting adults. I do not even like them, but I still see a huge difference to pedophiles.
Pedophilie is between an adult and a helpless child.
I can see them lowering the protected age further, mainly because the kids get sexually active earlier these days (shivvers), but only marginally.

[ScottL]

Diogenes, it's not 1 paper that discusses mental maturity as a biological mechanism, but years of research by thousands of scientists. There is a biological mechanism identified that relates to the development mentally of all people. For instance, most young children (10 and below) are technically sociopaths, showing no signs of remorse for their actions. The following early teen years they start to develop foresight and judgement, which decision making is erratic at best. By the late teens, most of this development has completed which is why legal consent is set at a late teen age. These are biological mechanisms with support across the board by scientists. Before the consentual age, you biologically are unlikely to be capable of making consistent rational choices.

[KitemanSA]

pedophiles may argue all they want. Its not up to them. The only argument here is AGE OF CONSENT. That definition will mostly come from psychologists and the like. They may very well lower them, but never will lower it enough to please pedophiles, because pedophiles want children if possible, and psychologists would probably, in CERTAIN cases, lower consent age above the pre-teens, but never lower than that.

Pedophilia is by definition the "love of" prepubescent children.
Also, the age of consent is only one issue. In most states there is an age that is lower than the age of consent where people can get married with their PARENT'S consent. That age is (or at least was) 14 in Texas. So having sex with a 14 year old in Texas is never pedaphilia, but may be statutory rape depending on the circumstances.

[Diogenes]

Oh dear. This is pointless.
Diogenes, dont you get it?
Homosexuals: two consenting adults. I do not even like them, but I still see a huge difference to pedophiles.
Pedophilie is between an adult and a helpless child.
I can see them lowering the protected age further, mainly because the kids get sexually active earlier these days (shivvers), but only marginally.

Skipjack don't YOU get it? The boundaries you describe are artificial.

[Diogenes]

Diogenes, it's not 1 paper that discusses mental maturity as a biological mechanism, but years of research by thousands of scientists. There is a biological mechanism identified that relates to the development mentally of all people. For instance, most young children (10 and below) are technically sociopaths, showing no signs of remorse for their actions. The following early teen years they start to develop foresight and judgement, which decision making is erratic at best. By the late teens, most of this development has completed which is why legal consent is set at a late teen age. These are biological mechanisms with support across the board by scientists. Before the consentual age, you biologically are unlikely to be capable of making consistent rational choices.

And this won't matter one bit to the proponents. Reason is not often the motivating force in political movements.

[Diogenes]

pedophiles may argue all they want. Its not up to them. The only argument here is AGE OF CONSENT. That definition will mostly come from psychologists and the like. They may very well lower them, but never will lower it enough to please pedophiles, because pedophiles want children if possible, and psychologists would probably, in CERTAIN cases, lower consent age above the pre-teens, but never lower than that.

Pedophilia is by definition the "love of" prepubescent children.
Also, the age of consent is only one issue. In most states there is an age that is lower than the age of consent where people can get married with their PARENT'S consent. That age is (or at least was) 14 in Texas. So having sex with a 14 year old in Texas is never pedaphilia, but may be statutory rape depending on the circumstances.

And this simply reinforces my point that such boundaries are artificial.