Forget The Moon - Climate Change

[MSimon]

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http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/spa ... 0904.story

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I know this is being discussed in other contexts.

NASA's plans to return astronauts to the moon are dead. So are the rockets being designed to take them there — that is, if President Barack Obama gets his way.

When the White House releases his budget proposal Monday, there will be no money for the Constellation program that was supposed to return humans to the moon by 2020. The troubled and expensive Ares I rocket that was to replace the space shuttle to ferry humans to space will be gone, along with money for its bigger brother, the Ares V cargo rocket that was to launch the fuel and supplies needed to take humans back to the moon.

There will be no lunar landers, no moon bases, no Constellation program at all.

In their place, according to White House insiders, agency officials, industry executives and congressional sources familiar with Obama's long-awaited plans for the space agency, NASA will look at developing a new "heavy-lift" rocket that one day will take humans and robots to explore beyond low Earth orbit. But that day will be years — possibly even a decade or more — away.

In the meantime, the White House will direct NASA to concentrate on Earth-science projects — principally, researching and monitoring climate change — and on a new technology research and development program that will one day make human exploration of asteroids and the inner solar system possible.

[Jccarlton]

So engineering gets shafted, aerospace is left to it's own devices and the GISS and the loon get the prize. sounds like the One all over. I remember what happened to Delta clipper and the X-37. At least in those cases NASA did it to themselves.

[Jccarlton]

So engineering gets shafted, aerospace is left to it's own devices and the GISS and the loon get the prize. sounds like the One all over. I remember what happened to Delta clipper and the X-37. At least in those cases NASA did it to themselves.

correction, make that x-33
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_Martin_X-33

[flying_eagle]

So engineering gets shafted, aerospace is left to it's own devices and the GISS and the loon get the prize. sounds like the One all over. I remember what happened to Delta clipper and the X-37. At least in those cases NASA did it to themselves.

Not at all, better technology like ion and eventual photon propulsion will happen over time as well as gather more of that climate sat data you guys love to argue about. All things being equal, probably a balanced decision. Sorry, there just isn't enough money unless you plan on giving up one of your core republican principles like "small government" for a a bigger bloated one. Unless you think bringing all the troops home from two war fronts, would pay for your proposal, then I'm for that.

[93143]

Better technology doesn't just happen. You have to research it.

Also, photon drive is nonsense. Even a fusion-powered spacecraft would get far better performance by just ejecting the fusion ash backwards.

Also, there is enough money. I have it on good authority that the HLV is coming a lot sooner than these doomsaying Stick fans want us to believe...

Cancelling the wars? Two weeks in Iraq alone is more extra money than NASA would know what to do with in an entire year. NASA gets half a percent of the federal budget - it's not about how much the United States can or can't afford; it's how much uncaring politicians can be persuaded to not slash from NASA's budget to give the impression of being thrifty without actually having a measurable effect on the nation's finances... Besides, whether or not it was a good idea to invade Iraq, both Iraq and especially Afghanistan need the foreign troops now and for a while yet. Afghanistan actually needs more. Withdrawal would just make things worse.

[DeltaV]

NASA's share is (and has been) a pittance compared to other budget items:




If the US Congress really cared about space exploration or space commerce, I'd be writing this from the Hotel Valles Marineris, or the Enceladus SubIce Adventure Inn.

The American people are too busy watching American Idol and the Superbowl to care, so Congress doesn't care either.

China will pick up where we left off.

[Josh Cryer]

They're directing NASA to shoot up satellites to measure climate change. Big fuc⁠⁠king deal. NASA gets nothing compared to the other parts of government, as per the image above.

[MirariNefas]

Where it says, "Treasury Dep. (includes interest on Debt)," I would like to know what else it includes.

[Josh Cryer]

Where it says, "Treasury Dep. (includes interest on Debt)," I would like to know what else it includes.

I believe interest takes a huge chunk of it. Clinton hated paying interest and that's one way he managed to balance the budget.

I never liked that we had to pay interest to ourselves because it seemed asinine, but it does make sense, in order to keep money printed on old blue jean scraps actually having value.

[old bald eagle]

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/e ... 004936.ece

Obtaining pecuniary advantage by deception

16.-(1) A person who by any deception dishonestly obtains for himself or another any pecuniary advantage shall on conviction on indictment be liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding five years.
(2) The cases in which a pecuniary advantage within the meaning of this section is to be regarded as obtained for a person are cases where -
(a) any debt or charge for which he makes himself liable or is or may become liable (including one not legally enforceable) is reduced or in whole or in part evaded or deferred; or
(b) he is allowed to borrow by way of overdraft, or to take out any policy of insurance or annuity contract, or obtains an improvement of the terms on which he is allowed to do so; or
(c) he is given the opportunity to earn remuneration or greater remuneration in an office or employment, or to win money by betting.
(3) For purposes of this section "deception" has the same meaning as in section 15 of this Act.
This section now only relates to offences committed prior to 15 January 2007. The Fraud Act 2006 has repealed this section and now has a wider and very different way of committing a fraudulent offence. See Fraud Act 2006 (Wikipedia)

[Skipjack]

I think the point is to rather by services from the commercials like the ULA and SpaceX. This is truly free market for space and IMHO a good thing.
I hope that this will get launch costs finally down.
Once they are low enough, we can go back to the moon or anywhere else.

[Josh Cryer]

Note that they're building Ares V (or a Direct equivalent), this takes us to NEOs, Mars' moons, or even Mars itself. Abandoning the moon is the best next step for human exploration of the cosmos. The moon was always a step back.

[doug l]

This hydrogen fuelled seabased cannon/launch system is showing up in a lot of places lately, along with his video presentation/lecture at the googleplex last December.
http://upcoming.current.com/items/75115 ... -orbit.htm

[CaptainBeowulf]

Yup, sounds like more doomsaying by stick fans. Good riddance to the stick.

In theory I have no problem with earth science satellites. These are not huge money-gobblers... and, hopefully they will give us solid data on temperature for once (depending on what they're set up to look for). With all the problems with surface stations, I would say that having solid satellite data is a good thing.

[Josh Cryer]

Fu⁠⁠ck the stick!