In Obama's America we don't Do hard

[zapkitty]

[[Aside: Did you know that there is, in fact, a spare solar array, as well as a spare radiator assembly? They don't have a ride up. If they're needed, and the Shuttle isn't flying, that's just too bad.]]

I wondered if that 5th PVR Lockmart et al had listed was a spare ... (eyes radiator speculatively... that's supposed to be about 9 kWt of heat rejection there... )

He says he cares. I don't believe him.

Wise.

What he wants most of all is NASA out of his hair as cheaply as possible so he can get on with doing the bidding of our lords and masters.

And the commercial space supporters in the administration have promised him exactly that. And he's going with it.

Not because he's a "socialist" or a "progressive" (how ridiculous can you get?) but because the oligarchs are salivating to implement punitive "austerity" measures on the populace and want Obama to protect that deficit hawk imagery at all costs.

[KitemanSA]

ooo and how about "The shuttle is an expensive dinosaur and the budget has just been struck with a gigaton asteroid...", or would that be too much?

Well maybe "its budget IS a gigaton asteroid..." After all, its budget is what is exploding, not that which is being exploded.

[IntLibber]

Yep, and if Constellation wasn't canceled SpaceX would never gotten commercial crew development, and crew launching would've been delayed by years. But thanks to Obama they're getting commercial crew.

Sorry Josh, but you and your messiah are wrong again here too. SpaceX received COTS-D funding for commercial crew development during the Bush administration. Only the CRS contract is for cargo, and they wont receive any of those funds until they start launching test dragons that are functioning.

While Griffin was a total twat, he did recognise the cost of using Orion for constant crew rotations at ISS was excessive and did provide funding for both COTS-D and CRS programs, although if they had fully funded COTS-D rather than diverting funds to Orion, Dragon may have been much further along by now.

[MSimon]

Nothing moves in a straight line. It is all fits and starts.

Polywell experiments being a case in point.

[Skipjack]

The foam loss issue has been solved;

No it has not been! What are you talking about? They still have to check the shuttle for damage while it is in orbit.

You know, if your congress is so stupid as to go back to Constellation and the shuttle, the US deserves to fall behind in space development. Because that is exactly what will happen then, unless some miracle comes along (like MACH thrusters, or a polywell based SSTO, or something like that).
Your politics are so convoluted that nothing ever moves! Heck if this worst case scenario happens, then even Europes space development is moving faster than yours.
LOL

[AcesHigh]

Polywell SSTO??

I have heard of Polywell powering a VASIMR, but not powering a SSTO (or anything else taking off from the planet).



How exactly would a Polywell SSTO work? Any interesting links?

One more reason to root for Polywell (haha, like if solving the world´s energy problems were already not enough)

[Josh Cryer]

IntLibber,

Sorry Josh, but you and your messiah are wrong again here too.

Is this statement necessary? I mentioned Obama because he is disliked here, not because I am enamored with him. It was basically a nice jab at the irrational conservatives who have been bashing the new, private space direction since Feb.

SpaceX received COTS-D funding for commercial crew development during the Bush administration.

No they did not. COTS-D was never initiated. Musk has been lobbying for it for nearly 4 years (20 days and it'll be 4 years). If you read the space act agreements, COTS-D is an option that NASA could exercise at any time. 3 budgets went through in that time period, at no time was it initiated. Frankly I'm annoyed that Obama took as long as he did to cancel Cx, but to do it politically he had to have the Augustine Commission come up with a reason.

Had COTS-D been initiated we'd be a whole lot further along with the PDR, CDR (Prelim and Critical Design Reviews). Milestones can be completed out of order, they don't have to be done sequentially. The PDRs and CDRs could've had a huge dent put in to them by now. The DRR probably not since a manned Dragon doesn't exist yet (but it too would have been further along if the option was initiated).

Only the CRS contract is for cargo, and they wont receive any of those funds until they start launching test dragons that are functioning.

Clarification, they don't get CRS money until they actually deliver cargo to the ISS. Seperate from the COTS-A-C milestone process. They have completed all but the demos (and DRRs) of COTS-A-C, and indeed, had completed those milestones months before Falcon 9 ever flew (scroll to bottom). No one really knows what's in the CRS contract because it hasn't been posted publicly, however, it is probably a boilerplate delivery contract. Do a delivery, get paid for it. Maybe an exception for insurance since they're a new company and have no real success rate criteria, but probably gets dropped after 4-5 flights.

While Griffin was a total twat, he did recognise the cost of using Orion for constant crew rotations at ISS was excessive and did provide funding for both COTS-D and CRS programs

I really don't get where you're hearing this but COTS-D was never ever initiated. Ever. SpaceX has not received one dime from COTS-D. None. Nada. They've likely prepared themselves for the various reviews, in anticipation of NASA initiation, but it has not happened.

although if they had fully funded COTS-D rather than diverting funds to Orion, Dragon may have been much further along by now.

If they had funded it at all, you mean.

You can read the space act agreements here: http://www.nasa.gov/offices/c3po/partne ... ments.html

[93143]

The foam loss issue has been solved;

No it has not been! What are you talking about? They still have to check the shuttle for damage while it is in orbit.

Of course they do. They're being cautious.

Also, MMOD is still a hazard.

Have you seen the latest tanks after ascent? They shed almost no foam. The intertank was a slight issue, but that's mostly solved now after they figured out it was dust and changed the cleaning procedure.

Remember, over 100 Shuttle missions flew before Columbia was lost, and not a single one suffered the same fate. It was actually a change in the insulation design - specifically the bipod ramp - only a few missions before STS-107 that produced a large, easily liberated chunk (that fell off and narrowly missed the orbiter on all three (IIRC?) missions prior to the accident). The design of the insulation in that area has been changed, and that can't happen any more.

...

BTW, I know I say "we" a lot, but that's more because of being a North American aerospace engineer rather than any sort of U.S. citizen/resident or NASA employee. I'm actually Canadian...

[KitemanSA]

Polywell SSTO??

I have heard of Polywell powering a VASIMR, but not powering a SSTO (or anything else taking off from the planet).

How exactly would a Polywell SSTO work? Any interesting links?

Try this:
http://www.askmar.com/Fusion_files/Iner ... ulsion.pdf

[AcesHigh]

Polywell SSTO??

I have heard of Polywell powering a VASIMR, but not powering a SSTO (or anything else taking off from the planet).

How exactly would a Polywell SSTO work? Any interesting links?

Try this:
http://www.askmar.com/Fusion_files/Iner ... ulsion.pdf

thanks. This forum is at its best when people talk about science instead of politics.

[MSimon]

Did some one mention POLITICS.....