Latest drug addict loons.

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williatw
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Re: Latest drug addict loons.

Post by williatw »

GIThruster wrote:William, to not be obtuse. It is unbecoming to pretend to be a moron.

Yes I see what you mean……”terminally ill” my foot, this is just the latest example of the ultimate in self-indulgent behavior from our increasingly permissive anything goes society. The idea that people have the temerity to think they can commit suicide anytime they like just because they think their life is too “hard”; get up off your ungrateful duff and work extra hard if your life isn’t what you in your narcissistic ego driven spoiled over-indulged mind you think you deserve. First they want to legalize drugs, then prostitution, gay marriage and now this; just another example of baby-boomer driven “me” culture; the arrogance of thinking you have some kind of right to decide when you should die; your life (and death) is a function of your effect on the society your undeserving arse is a part of whether you like it or not. You’ll die when your betters say you can die and not one nano-second before that; terminally ill my ass, they are just some lazy worthless sod who doesn’t deserve to live anyway and should be made to continue to just to show you whose boss.

GIThruster
Posts: 4686
Joined: Tue May 25, 2010 8:17 pm

Re: Latest drug addict loons.

Post by GIThruster »

Stop with the silly and pathetic straw man arguments! No one has made any allusion to these kinds of crazy statements you're pretending about.

Your position is completely untenable. You and I both know, there is nothing stopping anyone from swallowing a bottle of sleeping pills. There is NOTHING about suicide that requires we legitimize it. Anyone with a smidgeon of common sense knows, that you do not need permission to kill yourself. The permission only affects those who survive and how we think about the value of human life.

There is no value in your position whatsoever, and this is why you're resorting to rhetorical methods, like distraction fallacies and pretending to be a moron.
"Courage is not just a virtue, but the form of every virtue at the testing point." C. S. Lewis

Teahive
Posts: 362
Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2010 10:09 pm

Re: Latest drug addict loons.

Post by Teahive »

GIThruster wrote:It is really just people seeking approval for what they want to do. It's no different than the gay community fighting not for equal legal rights but for the term "married". They want approval for their behavior. In the case of suicide, the approval is for the sake of the survivors surrounding the person offing herself. Suicide victims want to believe they're doing nothing wrong.
And why should we disapprove if they aren't doing anything wrong?

williatw
Posts: 1912
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2009 7:15 pm
Location: Ohio

Re: Latest drug addict loons.

Post by williatw »

29-Year-old woman moves to Oregon for Legal aid in Dying

"Right now it's a choice that's only available to some Americans, which is really unethical," she says.

"The amount of sacrifice and change my family had to go through in order to get me to legal access to death with dignity – changing our residency, establishing a team of doctors, having a place to live – was profound," she says.

"There's tons of Americans who don’t have time or the ability or finances," she says, "and I don't think that's right or fair."

...

"I believe this choice is ethical, and what makes it ethical is it is a choice," she says. "The patient can change their mind right up to the last minute. I feel very protected here in Oregon."
http://reason.com/blog/2014/10/06/29-ye ... gon-for-le

GIThruster
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Re: Latest drug addict loons.

Post by GIThruster »

Teahive wrote:
GIThruster wrote:It is really just people seeking approval for what they want to do. It's no different than the gay community fighting not for equal legal rights but for the term "married". They want approval for their behavior. In the case of suicide, the approval is for the sake of the survivors surrounding the person offing herself. Suicide victims want to believe they're doing nothing wrong.
And why should we disapprove if they aren't doing anything wrong?
For the same reasons that we don't approve of prostitution--in order to do so, we have to agree to devalue humanity. We would be essentially removing the high bar of social expectation and promoting everyone rush to the bottom. Like it or not, Western Civilization is what it is--the flowering of humanity--because it has at most times and places held this primarily Judeo concept, but Christian as well, that human life is sacred. When you abandon that concept for convenience sake, the outcome is a rush to the bottom.
"Courage is not just a virtue, but the form of every virtue at the testing point." C. S. Lewis

williatw
Posts: 1912
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Location: Ohio

Re: Latest drug addict loons.

Post by williatw »

GIThruster wrote:For the same reasons that we don't approve of prostitution--in order to do so, we have to agree to devalue humanity. We would be essentially removing the high bar of social expectation and promoting everyone rush to the bottom. Like it or not, Western Civilization is what it is--the flowering of humanity--because it has at most times and places held this primarily Judeo concept, but Christian as well, that human life is sacred. When you abandon that concept for convenience sake, the outcome is a rush to the bottom.
Exactly...so the terminally ill people will just have to suck it up for the greater good of society. If you allow the allegedly "terminally ill" to off themselves with societies sanction, that's just the start of the slippery slope. No telling what kind of self-indulgent "rights" they will demand next.

GIThruster
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Re: Latest drug addict loons.

Post by GIThruster »

Why is it you can't relate the issue truthfully? There is no "letting" people off themselves. There's no way to stop them. The only sanction available against suicide does not affect the person killing himself, but instead, everyone they care about. Attributing to someone else your harsh thoughts is pure rhetoric that has no place, and only serves to cloud the issue. The issue is how we perceive human life.

The last time suicide was pandered to in the west, it was part of the Eugenics program in Germany in the 1930's. The Lovejoy institute went around picking up all the elderly folks who were a burden on society, and trucking them off to happier pastures where they were euthanized. That was what the first years of the progressive movement's work entailed, before they got to closing the churches and carting off the Jews. There is a stead progression here. There' no need of a slippery slope. It's the first rung on a ladder. It's not that one could suddenly slide down a slope. It's the belief that humans are not sacred that is the terrible thing that promotes atrocity. The murders of hundreds of millions in Maoist China and Stalinist Russia are the result of forsaking the belief that humanity is sacred. We are always just a little away from the attitude you want people to have, which is we can kill ourselves and each other out of convenience.
"Courage is not just a virtue, but the form of every virtue at the testing point." C. S. Lewis

hanelyp
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Re: Latest drug addict loons.

Post by hanelyp »

GIThruster wrote:The murders of hundreds of millions in Maoist China and Stalinist Russia are the result of forsaking the belief that humanity is sacred.
A point we forget at great peril. The abortion and euthanasia movements get nowhere without devaluing humanity or dehumanizing those they would have die.
The daylight is uncomfortably bright for eyes so long in the dark.

hanelyp
Posts: 2261
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2007 8:50 pm

Re: Latest drug addict loons.

Post by hanelyp »

The terrible truth about cannabis: Expert's devastating 20-year study finally demolishes claims that smoking pot is harmless
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/artic ... mless.html
One in six teenagers who regularly smoke the drug become dependent
It doubles risk of developing psychotic disorders, including schizophrenia
Heavy use in adolescence appears to impair intellectual development
Driving after smoking cannabis doubles risk of having a car crash
Study's author said: 'If cannabis is not addictive then neither is heroin'
The daylight is uncomfortably bright for eyes so long in the dark.

ladajo
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Location: North East Coast

Re: Latest drug addict loons.

Post by ladajo »

Cue misdirections and finger pointing about "the man" and "conspiracies"...
The development of atomic power, though it could confer unimaginable blessings on mankind, is something that is dreaded by the owners of coal mines and oil wells. (Hazlitt)
What I want to do is to look up C. . . . I call him the Forgotten Man. (Sumner)

Diogenes
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Re: Latest drug addict loons.

Post by Diogenes »

williatw wrote:
Exactly...so the terminally ill people will just have to suck it up for the greater good of society. If you allow the allegedly "terminally ill" to off themselves with societies sanction, that's just the start of the slippery slope. No telling what kind of self-indulgent "rights" they will demand next.


It certainly seems to be the case in the Netherlands. I don't know if you keep up with the subject, but they seem to be suicideing a lot of people who didn't ask to be suicided.



That Nazi (useless mouths) math is pretty appealing to socialist government bureaucrats. I think over time it becomes their SOP. I think it always evolves in that direction.
‘What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.’
— Lord Melbourne —

GIThruster
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Re: Latest drug addict loons.

Post by GIThruster »

Myth No. 1: “Marijuana is harmless and non-addictive”

No, marijuana is not as dangerous as cocaine or heroin, but calling it harmless or non-addictive denies very clear science embraced by every major medical association that has studied the issue. Scientists now know that the average strength of today’s marijuana is some 5–6 times what it was in the 1960s and 1970s, and some strains are upwards of 10–20 times stronger than in the past—especially if one extracts THC through a butane process. This increased potency has translated to more than 400,000 emergency room visits every year due to things like acute psychotic episodes and panic attacks.

Mental health researchers are also noting the significant marijuana connection with schizophrenia, and educators are seeing how persistent marijuana use can blunt academic motivation and significantly reduce IQ by up to eight points, according to a very large recent study in New Zealand. Add to these side-effects new research now finding that even casual marijuana use can result in observable differences in brain structure, specifically parts of the brain that regulate emotional processing, motivation and reward. Indeed, marijuana use hurts our ability to learn and compete in a competitive global workplace.

Additionally, marijuana users pose dangers on the road, despite popular myth. According to the British Medical Journal, marijuana intoxication doubles your risk of a car crash.

Myth No. 2: “Smoked or eaten marijuana is medicine.”

Just like we don’t smoke opium or inject heroin to get the benefits of morphine, we do not have to smoke marijuana to receive its medical effects. Currently, there is a pill based on marijuana’s active ingredient available at pharmacies, and almost two-dozen countries have approved a new mouth spray based on a marijuana extract. The spray, Sativex, does not get you high, and contains ingredients rarely found in street-grade marijuana. It is likely to be available in the U.S. soon, and today patients can enroll in clinical trials. While the marijuana plant has known medical value, that does not mean smoked or ingested whole marijuana is medicine. This position is in line with the American Medical Association, American Society of Addiction Medicine, American Glaucoma Foundation, National MS Society, and American Cancer Society.

Myth No. 3: “Countless people are behind bars simply for smoking marijuana.”

I wholeheartedly support reducing America’s incarceration rate. But legalizing marijuana will not make a significant dent in our imprisonment rates. That is because less than 0.3 percent of all state prison inmates are there for smoking marijuana. Moreover, most people arrested for marijuana use are cited with a ticket—very few serve time behind bars unless it is in the context of a probation or parole violation.

Myth No. 4: “The legality of alcohol and tobacco strengthen the case for legal marijuana.”

“Marijuana is safer than alcohol, so marijuana should be treated like alcohol” is a catchy, often-used mantra in the legalization debate. But this assumes that our alcohol policy is something worth modeling. In fact, because they are used at such high rate due to their wide availability, our two legal intoxicants cause more harm, are the cause of more arrests, and kill more people than all illegal drugs combined. Why add a third drug to our list of legal killers?

Moreover, marijuana legalization will usher in America’s new version of “Big Tobacco.”

Already, private holding groups and financiers have raised millions of start-up dollars to promote businesses that will sell marijuana and marijuana-related merchandise.
Cannabis food and candy is being marketed to children and are already responsible for a growing number of marijuana-related ER visits. Edibles with names such as “Ring Pots,” “Pot Tarts,” and “Kif Kat Bars” are inspired by common children candy and dessert products.
Profitable companies such as Medbox (based in California) has stated its plans to open marijuana vending machines containing products such as marijuana brownies. The former head of Strategy for Microsoft has said that he wants to “mint more millionaires than Microsoft” with marijuana and that he wants to create the “Starbucks of marijuana.”
Myth No. 5: “Legal marijuana will solve the government’s budgetary problems.”

Unfortunately, we can’t expect societal financial gain from marijuana legalization. For every $1 in revenue the U.S. receives in alcohol and tobacco taxes, we spend more than $10 in social costs. Additionally, two major business lobbies—Big Tobacco and the Liquor Lobby—have emerged to keep taxes on these drugs low and promote use. The last thing we need is the “Marlboroization of Marijuana,” but that is exactly what we would get in this country with legalization.

Myth No. 6: “Portugal and Holland provide successful models of legalization.”

Contrary to media reports, Portugal and Holland have not legalized drugs. In Portugal, someone caught with a small amount of drugs is sent to a three-person panel and given treatment, a fine, or a warning and release. The result of this policy is less clear. Treatment services were ramped up at the same time the new policy was implemented, and a decade later there are more young people using marijuana, but fewer people dying of opiate and cocaine overdoses. In the Netherlands, officials seem to be scaling back their marijuana non-enforcement policy (lived out in “coffee shops” across that country) after witnessing higher rates of marijuana use and treatment admissions there. The government now only allows residents to use coffee shops. What all of this tells us about how legalization would play out in the U.S. is another point entirely and even less clear.

Myth No. 7: “Prevention, intervention, and treatment are doomed to fail—So why try?”

Less than 8 percent of Americans smoke marijuana versus 52 percent who drink and 27 percent of people that smoke tobacco cigarettes. Coupled with its legal status, efforts to reduce demand for marijuana can work. Communities that implement local strategies implemented by area-wide coalitions of parents, schools, faith communities, businesses, and, yes, law enforcement, can significantly reduce marijuana use. Brief interventions and treatment for marijuana addiction (which affects about 1 in 6 kids who start using, according to the National Institutes of Health) can also work.

And one myth not found in the book: “Colorado and Washington are examples to follow.”

Experience from Colorado’s recent legalization of recreational marijuana is not promising. Since January, THC-positive test results in the workplace have risen, two recent deaths in Denver have been linked to recreational marijuana use, and the number of parents calling the poison control hotline because their kids consumed marijuana products has significantly risen. Additionally, tax revenues fall short of original projections and the black market for marijuana continues to thrive in Colorado. Though Washington State has not yet implemented its marijuana laws, the percentage of cases involving THC-positive drivers has significantly risen.

Marijuana policy is not straightforward. Any public policy has costs and benefits. It is true that a policy of saddling users with criminal records and imprisonment does not serve the nation’s best interests. But neither does legalization, which would create the 21st century version of Big Tobacco and reduce our ability to compete and learn. There is a better way to address the marijuana question—one that emphasizes brief interventions, prevention, and treatment, and would prove a far less costly alternative to either the status quo or legalization. That is the path America should be pursuing—call it “Reefer Sanity.”

http://dailysignal.com/2014/04/27/time-reefer-sanity/
"Courage is not just a virtue, but the form of every virtue at the testing point." C. S. Lewis

Diogenes
Posts: 6968
Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2009 3:33 pm

Re: Latest drug addict loons.

Post by Diogenes »

williatw wrote:
Exactly...so the terminally ill people will just have to suck it up for the greater good of society. If you allow the allegedly "terminally ill" to off themselves with societies sanction, that's just the start of the slippery slope. No telling what kind of self-indulgent "rights" they will demand next.


And then there's stuff like this:




http://www.lifenews.com/2014/10/08/medi ... ir-organs/
‘What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.’
— Lord Melbourne —

williatw
Posts: 1912
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2009 7:15 pm
Location: Ohio

Re: Latest drug addict loons.

Post by williatw »

williatw wrote:
Exactly...so the terminally ill people will just have to suck it up for the greater good of society. If you allow the allegedly "terminally ill" to off themselves with societies sanction, that's just the start of the slippery slope. No telling what kind of self-indulgent "rights" they will demand next.
Diogenes wrote:It certainly seems to be the case in the Netherlands. I don't know if you keep up with the subject, but they seem to be suicideing a lot of people who didn't ask to be suicided.

That Nazi (useless mouths) math is pretty appealing to socialist government bureaucrats. I think over time it becomes their SOP. I think it always evolves in that direction.
Diogenes wrote:
And then there's stuff like this:

http://www.lifenews.com/2014/10/08/medi ... ir-organs/

You know something "D"...you may have a point. If the gov healthcare (the Netherlands, probably Britain, etc.) are in charge of administering the patient's supposed "wish" to die, abuses are probably inevitable; and/or gross incompetence. There are the defacto death boards like waiting lists for treatments in Britain that function pretty close to that. As far as the Nazi's, Mao, Pol Pot, N. Korea, etc. are concerned they will do what they want anyway; they really don't need/care too much about having a euthanasia law to hide behind. In China I understand they execute 20K a year and go ape-shit harvesting their organs for transplant. I have even heard about foreigners going there to take advantage of the bonanza.

williatw
Posts: 1912
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2009 7:15 pm
Location: Ohio

Re: Latest drug addict loons.

Post by williatw »

hanelyp wrote: One in six teenagers who regularly smoke the drug become dependent
Yeah...I guess among anyone who is a regular user of just about anything the sub-group of those who become addicted (dependent) would logically be well represented. Just as most gambling addicts are regular gamblers, most people hooked on tobacco are regular users; most people who are alcoholics are regular drinkers. Of course it neglects to mention that the overwhelming majority of those who have tried pot are not regular users.

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