Li-ion battery with ~3X specific energy (Wh/kg) increase

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GIThruster
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Re: Li-ion battery with ~3X specific energy (Wh/kg) increase

Postby GIThruster » Thu Sep 19, 2013 4:24 pm

Interesting. Would be nice to know what sort of power density it has. If the rates are anything like contemporary Li-ions, this is disruptive indeed.

Imagine a Tesla Roadster with a 1,200 mile range.
"Courage is not just a virtue, but the form of every virtue at the testing point." C. S. Lewis

JLawson
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Re: Li-ion battery with ~3X specific energy (Wh/kg) increase

Postby JLawson » Thu Sep 19, 2013 4:56 pm

I'd be rather pleased with a cell phone battery I could go a week between charges on...

(Okay, I'm an underachiever in the realm of wishful thinking, lol...)
When opinion and reality conflict - guess which one is going to win in the long run.

Maui
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Re: Li-ion battery with ~3X specific energy (Wh/kg) increase

Postby Maui » Thu Sep 19, 2013 5:57 pm

I think we'd be talking more like an 800 mile range on the Tesla... not that's anything to shake a stick at. But more exciting, I think, would be an affordable Tesla with a 250 mile range.

Yet, every month or so there's a similar announcement from someone. I feel like making a list of all the announcements of various battery techs and charting their progress (or lack thereof). I have a feeling that > 50% of them, such a list would have no followup after the initial announcement. Here's hoping this one is different...

hanelyp
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Re: Li-ion battery with ~3X specific energy (Wh/kg) increase

Postby hanelyp » Thu Sep 19, 2013 7:36 pm

More energy density would be in some ways nice, but did anyone else think "bang"? System stability under large scale manufacture and real world use is important.
The daylight is uncomfortably bright for eyes so long in the dark.

JohnP
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Re: Li-ion battery with ~3X specific energy (Wh/kg) increase

Postby JohnP » Thu Sep 19, 2013 7:51 pm

hanelyp wrote:More energy density would be in some ways nice, but did anyone else think "bang"? System stability under large scale manufacture and real world use is important.


Yes. Greater energy density = more mischief when things go wrong.

dnavas
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Re: Li-ion battery with ~3X specific energy (Wh/kg) increase

Postby dnavas » Thu Sep 19, 2013 8:21 pm

Looks like the trick is going to be good cycling.
[They seem pretty convinced that their electrolyte will work.]

Betruger
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Re: Li-ion battery with ~3X specific energy (Wh/kg) increase

Postby Betruger » Thu Sep 19, 2013 10:25 pm

Range? Ha! Supercar Tesla...
You can do anything you want with laws except make Americans obey them. | What I want to do is to look up S. . . . I call him the Schadenfreudean Man.

Enginerd
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Re: Li-ion battery with ~3X specific energy (Wh/kg) increase

Postby Enginerd » Fri Sep 20, 2013 12:07 am

hanelyp wrote:More energy density would be in some ways nice, but did anyone else think "bang"? System stability under large scale manufacture and real world use is important.


Help me out here...
Wh = mAh * (V / 1000)
1 watt hour = 3600 joules

so at 5V: 1200mAh/g * (5V / 1000) * 3600 J/Wh = 21600 J/g
and at 12V: 1200mAh/g * (12V / 1000) * 3600 J/Wh = 51840 J/g

So this stuff at 12v would be better than gas. While the
energy density of gasoline is ~46000 J/g, gas tends not
to be able to suddenly dump all its energy.

The energy density of TNT is only 4184 J/g but it can
discharge the lot rather suddenly.

I expect these would be rather closer to TNT in their
ability to suddenly discharge stored energy. Have I
done the conversion wrong here, or is this going to be
rather nasty in a car wreck?
"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away."
--Philip K. Dick

93143
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Re: Li-ion battery with ~3X specific energy (Wh/kg) increase

Postby 93143 » Fri Sep 20, 2013 12:14 am

You can't vary the voltage that way; this isn't a capacitor. Individual voltaic cells have a characteristic potential that depends only on their chemistry (and a bit on the state of charge, especially near empty).

Given the fairly wide range of energy densities (and variation in characteristic potential) in different types of lithium ion cells, I'm not sure we have enough information here to figure out what the power density of this new entry would actually be.

They do make a big deal out of the design's "inherent safety", for what that's worth...

TheRadicalModerate
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Re: Li-ion battery with ~3X specific energy (Wh/kg) increase

Postby TheRadicalModerate » Thu Sep 26, 2013 8:17 pm

Betruger wrote:Range? Ha! Supercar Tesla...

You're not trying to build the equivalent of the JATO-equipped Chevy, are you? That didn't end well, apocryphally speaking.

Betruger
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Re: Li-ion battery with ~3X specific energy (Wh/kg) increase

Postby Betruger » Fri Sep 27, 2013 2:54 am

Crash And Burn ! 8)
You can do anything you want with laws except make Americans obey them. | What I want to do is to look up S. . . . I call him the Schadenfreudean Man.


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