Plasma Wall Interactions

MSimon · Post by **MSimon** » Mon Sep 12, 2011 8:30 am

http://www.ecnmag.com/News/2011/09/Air- ... eractions/

Researchers at the Georgia Institute of Technology and the University of Alabama have received a $2.5 million grant from the U.S. Air Force Office of Scientific Research (AFOSR) to conduct fundamental research into the ways in which plasmas interact with the walls of the structures containing them. The research will also examine potential improvements to materials used for the walls.

KitemanSA · Post by **KitemanSA** » Mon Sep 12, 2011 1:15 pm

hypersonic missile heat shields?
Hypersonic AIRCRAFT heat shields?

Betruger · Post by **Betruger** » Mon Sep 12, 2011 1:28 pm

research into the ways in which plasmas interact with the walls of the structures containing them

happyjack27 · Post by **happyjack27** » Mon Sep 12, 2011 4:33 pm

just your basic nuclear materials testing. probably for increasing the expected lifespan of a tokamak - a major limiting factor in the economic feasibility.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Test_Reactor

rcain · Post by **rcain** » Mon Sep 12, 2011 5:03 pm

... when you've given up trying to 'contain' plasma any other way...

happyjack27 · Post by **happyjack27** » Mon Sep 12, 2011 6:22 pm

rcain wrote:... when you've given up trying to 'contain' plasma any other way...

lol. if you can't keep the pot from melting, just buy a new one every meal, right?

rcain · Post by **rcain** » Mon Sep 12, 2011 7:53 pm

happyjack27 wrote:
rcain wrote:... when you've given up trying to 'contain' plasma any other way...
lol. if you can't keep the pot from melting, just buy a new one every meal, right?

perhaps a very thick pot. sacrificial, or reformed/recycled somehow. electrochemically perhaps.

bennmann · Post by **bennmann** » Mon Sep 12, 2011 8:43 pm

I wonder if someone could convince to Doctors in charge to use a polywell for the plasma instead of a tokamak? Less capacitors? More likely to receive positive press from Alan Boyle, for example?

Persuade the scientist to use small polywells for more testing purposes....

rcain · Post by **rcain** » Mon Sep 12, 2011 8:48 pm

@bennmann - very good suggestion.

D Tibbets · Post by **D Tibbets** » Tue Sep 13, 2011 8:07 pm

rcain wrote:
happyjack27 wrote:
rcain wrote:... when you've given up trying to 'contain' plasma any other way...
lol. if you can't keep the pot from melting, just buy a new one every meal, right?
perhaps a very thick pot. sacrificial, or reformed/recycled somehow. electrochemically perhaps.

Precisely. At least for the NIF. IF they push to a power producing pulsed laser system and stick with gold horboliums (sp?), they will be vaporizing and to a small extent transmuting ~ a BB sized chunk of gold at up to perhaps a hundred shots per second. This may approximate ~ 1 once of gold per second, or almost $2,000 per second, $ 120,000 per minute or almost $3,000,000 per hr in gold consumption alone. How much of this can be recovered. How much will be deposited on the vessel walls. Removing it will require concentrated nitric acid which will not be kind to the underlieing metal, unless some other clever mechanism can be used. Without high efficiency recycling a couple of plants might burn through the entire worlds gold supply in only a few years. The only substitute high density metal that I speculate might work at lower cost and greater abundance might be lead, silver, tin, tungsten, or even mercury. Uranium , and thorium would have induced radiation problems, Could the system be made to work with a lighter metal such as aluminum, iron, nickel or copper? Osmium or platinum would cost even more than the gold.

Dan Tibbets

rjaypeters · Post by **rjaypeters** » Wed Sep 14, 2011 12:03 am

.
Posted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 5:19 pm

rjaypeters wrote:horboliums => Hohlraum?

Dan, Did you write "horboliums" just to get me to respond?

You are consistent in your humanity, I must say.

Say it after me: "Hole Rowm". Now say it again. Write it a few times, just for fun...

viewtopic.php?t=2661&start=0

Skipjack · Post by **Skipjack** » Wed Sep 14, 2011 12:37 am

Precisely. At least for the NIF. IF they push to a power producing pulsed laser system and stick with gold horboliums (sp?), they will be vaporizing and to a small extent transmuting ~ a BB sized chunk of gold at up to perhaps a hundred shots per second. This may approximate ~ 1 once of gold per second, or almost $2,000 per second, $ 120,000 per minute or almost $3,000,000 per hr in gold consumption alone. How much of this can be recovered. How much will be deposited on the vessel walls. Removing it will require concentrated nitric acid which will not be kind to the underlieing metal, unless some other clever mechanism can be used. Without high efficiency recycling a couple of plants might burn through the entire worlds gold supply in only a few years. The only substitute high density metal that I speculate might work at lower cost and greater abundance might be lead, silver, tin, tungsten, or even mercury. Uranium , and thorium would have induced radiation problems, Could the system be made to work with a lighter metal such as aluminum, iron, nickel or copper? Osmium or platinum would cost even more than the gold.

Exactly my view of the situations as well. It is an absolutely ridiculous concept. If you ask me, it is all about the weapons applications of this, not about any serious research into fusion energy. That is just a means to sell it to the gullible public, so they keep the dollars flowing.

hanelyp · Post by **hanelyp** » Wed Sep 14, 2011 1:04 am

gold horboliums (sp?)

Horriblums?

Vaporizing umpteen precision made pieces for a power reactor strikes me as a horrible idea. The gold should be mostly recoverable. The machining costs would eat you alive.

happyjack27 · Post by **happyjack27** » Wed Sep 14, 2011 12:58 pm

...like i said: not economically viable.

KitemanSA · Post by **KitemanSA** » Wed Sep 14, 2011 1:18 pm

hanelyp wrote:
gold horboliums (sp?)
Horriblums? Vaporizing umpteen precision made pieces for a power reactor strikes me as a horrible idea. The gold should be mostly recoverable. The machining costs would eat you alive.

A BLOOMING horrible idea. Horriblooms!