10KW LENR demonstrator (new thread)

Point out news stories, on the net or in mainstream media, related to polywell fusion.

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rcain
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Postby rcain » Wed Nov 30, 2011 3:51 am

just to show some balance in this coverage, picked up the following links which are a little more impressive (at first glance at any rate):

http://hydrofusion.com/

- a british company, owned by swedish entrepreneurs charged with northern european marketing. one of the board at least has a Phd in physics.

and of course the http://ecat.com/ web site built by them for Rossi.

all look quite pretty, and will i'm sure, at some point, be subject to the european 'sales of goods act', [edit] not to mention advertising standards laws[/edit], i dare say.

(original story here http://www.nyteknik.se/nyheter/energi_m ... 347150.ece - which i missed.)

Maui
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Postby Maui » Wed Nov 30, 2011 4:20 am

ladajo wrote:I will not apologize for my scepticism. That would be like like asking me to apologize for my vote after an election where my candidate lost.

QFT

MSimon
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Postby MSimon » Wed Nov 30, 2011 1:59 pm

Parallel is notorious over at ArsTechnica, so much so that posters were requesting a ban on him.


The moderation policy around here (set by Joe S) is very liberal. You absolutely wouldn't believe what it takes to be banned. It happened once in the very early days. And the guy had to violate policy continuously after repeated warnings.

No one has even come close to that guy in the intervening years.

Parallel is quite safe around here. ;-)
Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.

MSimon
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Postby MSimon » Wed Nov 30, 2011 2:04 pm

it is true. IF Rossi comes up with the goods - and that means of course, undoubtedly, also a Nobel Prize, then I will look truly meek, humble, wrong and sorry before him.

that day has not come yet my friend.


LMAO!!11!!
Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.

parallel
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Postby parallel » Wed Nov 30, 2011 2:59 pm

Defkalion has published detailed specifications for their Hyperions.
http://www.defkalion-energy.com/files/H ... er2011.pdf

parallel
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Postby parallel » Wed Nov 30, 2011 3:11 pm

MSimon wrote:
Parallel is notorious over at ArsTechnica, so much so that posters were requesting a ban on him.


The moderation policy around here (set by Joe S) is very liberal. You absolutely wouldn't believe what it takes to be banned. It happened once in the very early days. And the guy had to violate policy continuously after repeated warnings.

No one has even come close to that guy in the intervening years.

Parallel is quite safe around here. ;-)

I hadn't seen that post. as I skip what ScottL writes. until this caused me to go back and look.
I had two running arguments with a couple of moderators there. One was about hormesis, where I wrote that is was proven (and more confirmation has since surfaced) that "DrJonBoy" (?) couldn't stand and so locked the thread. I left in disgust and haven't been back since.
The other was with a pompous twit about AGW. I think it safe to say recent history has confirmed my point of view that the forcing factors used by IPCC are too high.

ladajo
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Postby ladajo » Wed Nov 30, 2011 3:15 pm

parallel wrote:Defkalion has published detailed specifications for their Hyperions.
http://www.defkalion-energy.com/files/H ... er2011.pdf


Certainly ups the drama of the game. Nice pretty glossy.

Kahuna
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Postby Kahuna » Wed Nov 30, 2011 3:21 pm

ladajo wrote:
parallel wrote:Defkalion has published detailed specifications for their Hyperions.
http://www.defkalion-energy.com/files/H ... er2011.pdf


Certainly ups the drama of the game. Nice pretty glossy.


and COP claims from 25 -> 32

If true, it blow E-Cats away in the marketplace. I thought we were supposed to hear about 3rd party testing also. Did not see that in there but could have missed it on the first pass.

ladajo
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Postby ladajo » Wed Nov 30, 2011 3:31 pm

They talk about it in the Press Release:

http://www.defkalion-energy.com/files/P ... logies.pdf

MSimon
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Postby MSimon » Wed Nov 30, 2011 3:37 pm

parallel wrote:
MSimon wrote:
Parallel is notorious over at ArsTechnica, so much so that posters were requesting a ban on him.


The moderation policy around here (set by Joe S) is very liberal. You absolutely wouldn't believe what it takes to be banned. It happened once in the very early days. And the guy had to violate policy continuously after repeated warnings.

No one has even come close to that guy in the intervening years.

Parallel is quite safe around here. ;-)

I hadn't seen that post. as I skip what ScottL writes. until this caused me to go back and look.
I had two running arguments with a couple of moderators there. One was about hormesis, where I wrote that is was proven (and more confirmation has since surfaced) that "DrJonBoy" (?) couldn't stand and so locked the thread. I left in disgust and haven't been back since.
The other was with a pompous twit about AGW. I think it safe to say recent history has confirmed my point of view that the forcing factors used by IPCC are too high.


There is an old saying "it is not the poison, it is the dose". That small doses of some poisons are actually helpful has been known for a some time. The problem with relaxing standards is that it increases the probability of a beyond safe accident. But make the standards too tough and corners will get cut or production will stop. Balance.

And you are quite correct about AGW.

Makes me wonder why you are such a Rossi fan boy.

LENR has been studied for 20+ years and as far as I can tell it has yet to be reduced to engineering practice. And the lab boys are not consistent either.
Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.

ladajo
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Postby ladajo » Wed Nov 30, 2011 3:40 pm

Defkalion also says they will allow for Gamma monitoring to prove the LENR reaction. Saw it in a blog post on the website. Interesting, they are certainly upstaging Rossi today.

Although, he will claim, "I am already selling and shipping units! What have they sold and shipped? And when will they do it?"

http://www.defkalion-energy.com/forum/v ... f=17&t=580

TallDave
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Postby TallDave » Wed Nov 30, 2011 4:04 pm

ladajo wrote:Defkalion also says they will allow for Gamma monitoring to prove the LENR reaction. Saw it in a blog post on the website. Interesting, they are certainly upstaging Rossi today.

Although, he will claim, "I am already selling and shipping units! What have they sold and shipped? And when will they do it?"

http://www.defkalion-energy.com/forum/v ... f=17&t=580


Wow, that is interesting, thanks for sharing!

Even it doesn't go anywhere, this sure is fun!
n*kBolt*Te = B**2/(2*mu0) and B^.25 loss scaling? Or not so much? Hopefully we'll know soon...

TallDave
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Postby TallDave » Wed Nov 30, 2011 4:23 pm

Crawdaddy wrote:The point of my comment is that known reactions are not empirical they agree with theory and can be predicted by calculation from first principles using quantum theory.
Yes, but that's a meaningless distinction. It does NOT mean every possible reaction is now known and Mankind will never discover a new and unexpected chemical reaction empirically. See, for instance:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 141550.htm

That's not to throw out theory entirely -- as I said, I would be interested in looking at chemical potential.

Another misconception engendered by your post is the notion that chemical reactions can be controlled to release large amounts of energy at a slow steady rate.
Obviously that depends on the reaction, the engineering, and the value of "large"; a simple bonfire will burn for days. Again, you seem to be confusing "not easy" with "not possible." If it was something simple and easy, we wouldn't be talking about it here. And some petroleum engineers have remarked on something similar occurring with hydrogen-doped nickel catalysts, in an uncontrolled fashion.

If you are interested in the possible chemical mechanisms of fraud in the rossi demonstrations, the vortex mailing list has addressed these issues ad nauseum. You can easily find all the data you require there.
Thanks, maybe I'll check that out, hopefully the arguments have some numbers on chemical potential based on volume/mass.
Last edited by TallDave on Wed Nov 30, 2011 4:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
n*kBolt*Te = B**2/(2*mu0) and B^.25 loss scaling? Or not so much? Hopefully we'll know soon...

parallel
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Postby parallel » Wed Nov 30, 2011 4:38 pm

MSimon,
Makes me wonder why you are such a Rossi fan boy.

You will find I'm right about that too. :wink:

Kahuna
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Postby Kahuna » Wed Nov 30, 2011 4:45 pm

ladajo wrote:They talk about it in the Press Release:

http://www.defkalion-energy.com/files/P ... logies.pdf


Thanks L, although this seems to only talk about future 3rd party testing programs. I thought they might name an independent firm that had already conducted validation tests on their pre-production units.

All the preview press releases would lead one to believe that third party validation testing had been done against the claims in the specs (like an accounting form would do for a set of financial statements).


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