10KW LENR Demonstrator?

[KitemanSA]

Yes I am sure that discussed here on 170 pages Rossi's device was described as nickel's nanopowder (or chemical activated powder) at hydrogen atmosphere reacting with the help of some "secret catalyst". And here was discussed possibility of Ni hydrogen nuclear fusion.

And 1.2 MJ can boil alot of water. Heat capacity of water ~4200 J/kg*deg + electric heaters that was in one drawing that I saw.

I think Giorgio's point here is that if you are going to presume fraud, any possibility is open, including lying about the experiment. But IF the reported heat output is true, there is no way to provide that amount of anergy in ANY chemical process using that volume of material. Even if you presume the reaction is H:F, there isn't enough. So it isn't "chemical". It may be "fraud" with chamical etc. It could be delusion in many ways. But it is NOT a mistake with chemical energy.

[Giorgio]

Yes I am sure that discussed here on 170 pages Rossi's device was described as nickel's nanopowder (or chemical activated powder) at hydrogen atmosphere reacting with the help of some "secret catalyst". And here was discussed possibility of Ni hydrogen nuclear fusion.

I am not following you.
Either we discuss about a possible chemical reaction, or we discuss about a possible nuclear reaction.

And 1.2 MJ can boil alot of water. Heat capacity of water ~4200 J/kg*deg + electric heaters that was in one drawing that I saw.

They are using 10Kg to release 1,2MJ.
Rossi is stating 50 grams (If I remember correctly) in the small reactor.
If you make proportion it means that from 50 grams you can get 6000 J.
You do not boil much water with 6000J, so chemical reaction is excluded.

[Joseph Chikva]

Fact that he can not measure heat. "700 keV electron in lattice"?

The PRESUMED requirement for Widom-Larsen theory to work. Keep up, dude!
Did I miss another claim of this condition?
Of course, the KK might have this kind of value build into it. I guess I'll have to check.

Listen dude,
Rossi could not measure heat. Then like a woman he named his opponent "snake" when not liked his interview. I saw only two these.

And if you think that Widom-Larsen or any other effect will heat electrons in crystal lattice at 700keV and crystal remains solid
My congratulations.

[Joseph Chikva]

Yes I am sure that discussed here on 170 pages Rossi's device was described as nickel's nanopowder (or chemical activated powder) at hydrogen atmosphere reacting with the help of some "secret catalyst". And here was discussed possibility of Ni hydrogen nuclear fusion.

I am not following you.
Either we discuss about a possible chemical reaction, or we discuss about a possible nuclear reaction.

And 1.2 MJ can boil alot of water. Heat capacity of water ~4200 J/kg*deg + electric heaters that was in one drawing that I saw.

They are using 10Kg to release 1,2MJ.
Rossi is stating 50 grams (If I remember correctly) in the small reactor.
If you make proportion it means that from 50 grams you can get 6000 J.
You do not boil much water with 6000J, so chemical reaction is excluded.

Visually his reactor can containe more than 10kg of Nickel. And Mr. Rossi allows an occasion to doubt in his truthfulness.

[Joseph Chikva]

Yes I am sure that discussed here on 170 pages Rossi's device was described as nickel's nanopowder (or chemical activated powder) at hydrogen atmosphere reacting with the help of some "secret catalyst". And here was discussed possibility of Ni hydrogen nuclear fusion.

And 1.2 MJ can boil alot of water. Heat capacity of water ~4200 J/kg*deg + electric heaters that was in one drawing that I saw.

I think Giorgio's point here is that if you are going to presume fraud, any possibility is open, including lying about the experiment. But IF the reported heat output is true, there is no way to provide that amount of anergy in ANY chemical process using that volume of material. Even if you presume the reaction is H:F, there isn't enough. So it isn't "chemical". It may be "fraud" with chamical etc. It could be delusion in many ways. But it is NOT a mistake with chemical energy.

the reported heat output was not true.

[Giorgio]

Visually his reactor can containe more than 10kg of Nickel.

I doubt his reactor could reach the 10Kg of weight even if it was done by solid Nickel...
Anyhow, this is really not important unless I understand before if you are convinced that their data can be explained by a chemical reaction or if you think that they are simply misreading their results.

From one of your previous posts I got the impression that you think that their claims can be explained by a simple chemical reaction. Is that so?
Please clarify.

[Joseph Chikva]

Visually his reactor can containe more than 10kg of Nickel.

I doubt his reactor could reach the 10Kg of weight even if it was done by solid Nickel...
Anyhow, this is really not important unless I understand before if you are convinced that their data can be explained by a chemical reaction or if you think that they are simply misreading their results.

From one of your previous posts I got the impression that you think that their claims can be explained by a simple chemical reaction. Is that so?
Please clarify.

Not only chemical but chemical + electric heating.

[KitemanSA]

It may be "fraud" with chamical etc. It could be delusion in many ways. But it is NOT a mistake with chemical energy.

the reported heat output was not true.

This is one way.

[Joseph Chikva]

It may be "fraud" with chamical etc. It could be delusion in many ways. But it is NOT a mistake with chemical energy.

the reported heat output was not true.

This is one way.

Thank you for discussion.

[seedload]

I've wondered why there isn't more interest in Piantelli's work in this thread. Didn't he publish sufficient instructions to allow for independent replication of a claim of achieving reliable, if very modest, production of heat? Or do I have the wrong impression?

EDIT: http://www.newenergytimes.com/v2/news/2 ... g.shtml#pf

For me, the fact that he also claims that his device cures cancer is a good enough reason not to have any interest. But that is just me.

[seedload]

If you have FACTS, present them.

Kite, out of pure logic, shouldn't be Rossi the one presenting the data?

We know that he is NOT going to provide facts. If you want speculation as to why, perhaps he is of the opinion the if he PROVES it works scientifically before he has built a big enough business that he will be over-run by "Johnnies-come-lately". But that is speculation.
He has stated that he is NOT going to provide facts. We all lambast him for not providing them. We then emulate him and make all sorts of arguments against him "without facts". How then are we purer than he is? Someone about 68 pages ago lamented that we were going to spend 100+ pages discussing nothing. And to a great degree, we are still at it.

FACTS? Anyone? FACTS?

The most likely reason for him not providing facts is that there are none.

[bennmann]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophi ... n_of_proof

and

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_burden_of_proof

I think that about sums it up.

[KitemanSA]

FACTS? Anyone? FACTS?

The most likely reason for him not providing facts is that there are none.

Actually, the MOST likely is that he has none he wishes to share. But having none at all is also a minor possibility.
But I am asking YOU for facts. I already know HE is not going to provide them. I am asking YOU to provide FACTUAL arguments about this one way or the other. Or are you, like him, just f@rting into the wind?

I've gotten ~3 people to actually provide fact based reasoning (faulty, but fact based) on why this can't work. I believe I have been successful in dismissing all said arguments. Are there any others?

[KitemanSA]

For me, the fact that he also claims that his device cures cancer is a good enough reason not to have any interest. But that is just me.

Source?

[Giorgio]

Not only chemical but chemical + electric heating.

What does it mean?