Polywell Sketch

Point out news stories, on the net or in mainstream media, related to polywell fusion.

Moderators: tonybarry, MSimon

MSimon
Posts: 14331
Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 7:37 pm
Location: Rockford, Illinois
Contact:

Polywell Sketch

Postby MSimon » Thu Apr 15, 2010 1:17 am

Interesting visualization of Polywell.

http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/ ... 5e&ct=hprm
Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.

hanelyp
Posts: 2253
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2007 8:50 pm

Postby hanelyp » Thu Apr 15, 2010 2:48 am

20 circular coils in dodecahedron vertex centered configuration. I think that would work. I presume the solid between the coils is an artifact of the modeling method, and would be open in a real machine.

BenTC
Posts: 410
Joined: Tue Jun 09, 2009 4:54 am

Postby BenTC » Thu Apr 15, 2010 12:53 pm

I thought I'd be funny and say that the clear cylinder protecting the vacuum must be transparent aluminum but apparently transparent aluminium now exists.
In theory there is no difference between theory and practice, but in practice there is.

Aeronaut
Posts: 58
Joined: Fri Jun 05, 2009 11:36 am
Location: West Michigan
Contact:

Postby Aeronaut » Sun Apr 18, 2010 11:33 am

Fascinating.

Assuming the door is anywhere near scale, this would extend vertically into a destroyer's aft deckhouse. Can't wait to see some indications of the supporting subsystems.

I can see this model needing about the same engineering spaces' volume as a 107x class fast frigate (FF 1070) or FFG used to need. Both were single prop, single engine room, single fire room models.

But the gains would be freeing up the fuel tanks, eliminating the oil bill, and gaining instant power. Tremendous strategic and tactical gains. :D
The Power To Get Things Done

MSimon
Posts: 14331
Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 7:37 pm
Location: Rockford, Illinois
Contact:

Postby MSimon » Sun Apr 18, 2010 11:54 am

Aeronaut wrote:Fascinating.

Assuming the door is anywhere near scale, this would extend vertically into a destroyer's aft deckhouse. Can't wait to see some indications of the supporting subsystems.

I can see this model needing about the same engineering spaces' volume as a 107x class fast frigate (FF 1070) or FFG used to need. Both were single prop, single engine room, single fire room models.

But the gains would be freeing up the fuel tanks, eliminating the oil bill, and gaining instant power. Tremendous strategic and tactical gains. :D


No more boiler heating rate limitations, no more "cold slug" into the reactor worries.

And the possibility of 1 second pulse rating of 2X rated power. Maybe 5X or 10X for .1 second.

The fuel bunkers get at least partially filled with aviation fuel.
Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.

Aeronaut
Posts: 58
Joined: Fri Jun 05, 2009 11:36 am
Location: West Michigan
Contact:

Postby Aeronaut » Sun Apr 18, 2010 5:40 pm

MSimon wrote:
Aeronaut wrote:Fascinating.

Assuming the door is anywhere near scale, this would extend vertically into a destroyer's aft deckhouse. Can't wait to see some indications of the supporting subsystems.

I can see this model needing about the same engineering spaces' volume as a 107x class fast frigate (FF 1070) or FFG used to need. Both were single prop, single engine room, single fire room models.

But the gains would be freeing up the fuel tanks, eliminating the oil bill, and gaining instant power. Tremendous strategic and tactical gains. :D


No more boiler heating rate limitations, no more "cold slug" into the reactor worries.

And the possibility of 1 second pulse rating of 2X rated power. Maybe 5X or 10X for .1 second.

The fuel bunkers get at least partially filled with aviation fuel.


The Av fuel is for the helo?

This is getting interesting. What overheats in an "overloaded" PW?
The Power To Get Things Done

MSimon
Posts: 14331
Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 7:37 pm
Location: Rockford, Illinois
Contact:

Postby MSimon » Sun Apr 18, 2010 6:26 pm

This is getting interesting. What overheats in an "overloaded" PW?


Power transformation semiconductors.

Av fuel is for the CV.
Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.

Aeronaut
Posts: 58
Joined: Fri Jun 05, 2009 11:36 am
Location: West Michigan
Contact:

Postby Aeronaut » Mon Apr 19, 2010 12:11 am

Is there a definitions doc or thread that could be expanded to become an introductory crash course?

The reasons I learned Focus Fusion first are the more compact design and more newbie friendly materials.

Although I see FF reaching unity and production first, it and the PW are wonderfully complementary designs with their own niches in a fusion powered world.

The way CBFR was drawn on the UC Irvine site, it looked like maybe they would be a natural in the 50MW range. They had a detailed and credible 3D drawing showing the reactor on a mezzanine over the support gear.
The Power To Get Things Done

KitemanSA
Posts: 6114
Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 3:05 pm
Location: OlyPen WA

Postby KitemanSA » Mon Apr 19, 2010 12:22 am

Aeronaut wrote:Is there a definitions doc or thread that could be expanded to become an introductory crash course?
Look at the begining of each of the "Technical Group" fora and you will see a sticky that tells you of a Technical FAQ. It is a wiki and can be improved as you wish.

Input ALWAYS welcome.

kunkmiester
Posts: 873
Joined: Thu Mar 12, 2009 3:51 pm
Contact:

Postby kunkmiester » Mon Apr 19, 2010 12:25 am

Supporting equipment are the vacuum pumps, ion injectors and stuff not shown, power converters and the cryogenics plant. Likely part of the fuel bunkers would also go to dewer flasks to store extra coolant for a few hours operation at least if the cryo plant goes down.

Cryo would also be partly offset by the use of a superconducting motor, which takes less space than a conventional electric motor, and probably superconducting power buses running through the ship. With that much cold stuff laying around, I'm sure someone will think of other uses for it.
Evil is evil, no matter how small

Aeronaut
Posts: 58
Joined: Fri Jun 05, 2009 11:36 am
Location: West Michigan
Contact:

Postby Aeronaut » Mon Apr 19, 2010 12:53 pm

Thanx for the link, KitemanSA.

@Kunkmeister, I agree about the cryo motors. Hadn't thought about cryo busses and multiple cryo plants. Looks like this is going to be huge. More on the lines of a Spruance class destroyer or a DDG-5x class like the Cole.

Maybe one retrofit for the operational testbed, followed by an entirely new design.

Are there any expected problems with materials science to keep all that cold stuff contained and insulated at a reasonable cost for industrial applications?
The Power To Get Things Done

Aeronaut
Posts: 58
Joined: Fri Jun 05, 2009 11:36 am
Location: West Michigan
Contact:

Postby Aeronaut » Wed Apr 21, 2010 12:25 pm

Great job on the FAQ wiki, KitemanSA. Couldn't find what CV means, but I did gain a much better understanding of how a PW may function and fit into the existing power grid.

I also visited the EMC2 site and saw a sketch of a much smaller PW cube. Surely that's not the 100 MW size for a drop-in reactor/ vacuum module?
The Power To Get Things Done

KitemanSA
Posts: 6114
Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 3:05 pm
Location: OlyPen WA

Postby KitemanSA » Wed Apr 21, 2010 4:40 pm

Aeronaut wrote:Great job on the FAQ wiki, KitemanSA. Couldn't find what CV means, but I did gain a much better understanding of how a PW may function and fit into the existing power grid.

I also visited the EMC2 site and saw a sketch of a much smaller PW cube. Surely that's not the 100 MW size for a drop-in reactor/ vacuum module?
In MSimon's post, CV refers to Carrier Vessel, as in CVN-78 or USS John F. Kennedy, (CV-67).

If you mean the mostly transparent picture at the right of the three picture near the top, that one is the WB-8 (check out the properties of the image). The solid picture of the box with man and the fork-lift is, and is labeled, WB-D (Demo), the 100MW version. The WB-D won't necessarily include the "Venetian Blind" power collecting stuff, so the box may be smaller than a real power reactor.

DeltaV
Posts: 2245
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2009 5:05 am

Postby DeltaV » Wed Apr 21, 2010 6:56 pm

KitemanSA wrote:The solid picture of the box with man and the fork-lift is, and is labeled, WB-D (Demo), the 100MW version.

Look closely. It's not a man. It's an android or cyborg trying to pass itself off as human by wearing jeans and boots. This could explain a lot.

Image

Aero
Posts: 1200
Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2008 4:36 am
Location: 92111

Postby Aero » Wed Apr 21, 2010 10:51 pm

And the Forklift is not a Forklift, it's a Transformer!
Aero


Return to “News”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests