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Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 6:31 pm
by Giorgio
KitemanSA wrote:That is odd since it was the French who insisted on the "tonne" spelling. Don't usually have good things to say about the French, but in this case (if those who are SUPPOSED to be SI users would ACTUALLY use SI) there would be a pleasant reduction in confusion.
Why not start now. When you mean 1000kg, write tonne. When you mean 2000 lb, write ton. When you mean 20 cwt, write Long ton (I'd accept l-ton).
As betruger says here in Europe if you are under 50 than you have no other definitions for a ton than 1000 Kg. You get to learn this since elementary school.
I did meet quite a lot of UK and pre SI engineers that used to jump from SI to more obscure units, but that's just something that is disappearing (thank goodness).
Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 8:21 pm
by rcain
KitemanSA wrote:That is odd since it was the French who insisted on the "tonne" spelling. Don't usually have good things to say about the French, but in this case (if those who are SUPPOSED to be SI users would ACTUALLY use SI) there would be a pleasant reduction in confusion.
Why not start now. When you mean 1000kg, write tonne. When you mean 2000 lb, write ton. When you mean 20 cwt, write Long ton (I'd accept l-ton).
seconded.
(also in deference to Giorgio's lineage, we might also give the 'acino', the 'trappesso' and the 'rotolo' a mention - part of the old Neapolitan system of weights
)
Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 8:42 pm
by ladajo
I found in my time in Italy that the most predominant unit of measure used was "Cosi".
Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 9:08 pm
by Skipjack
To make the confusion complete and maybe also more understandable (especially the position of us non native English speakers):
http://www.dict.cc/?s=Tonne
English German
ton <t> Tonne {f} [Massemaß] <t>
Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 10:39 pm
by Betruger
ladajo wrote:I found in my time in Italy that the most predominant unit of measure used was "Cosi".
Hehe
Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 11:18 pm
by Giorgio
Skipjack wrote:To make the confusion complete and maybe also more understandable (especially the position of us non native English speakers):
http://www.dict.cc/?s=Tonne
English German
ton <t> Tonne {f} [Massemaß] <t>
I think that the mayhem is now complete!
Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 11:42 pm
by Skipjack
I think that the mayhem is now complete!
Good, then its "mission accomplished"!
Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 12:23 am
by krenshala
Betruger wrote:Sure. But the point is that anytime you heard ton it was almost negligible chance it meant anything but 1000 kg. I can't recall the last time, if ever, that I saw Mg meaning million kg.
I don't mind it myself but it's not intuitive at first glance for probably most people.
Um ... you got that wrong. 1 Mg is not 1 million kg, it is 1 Million grams. I figured Mg would be pretty intuitive for anyone familiar with the metric system.
Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 12:39 am
by KitemanSA
Betruger wrote: I can't recall the last time, if ever, that I saw Mg meaning million kg.
Never, I hope. Mg is 1000kg, not a million kg.
Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 12:42 am
by KitemanSA
ladajo wrote:I found in my time in Italy that the most predominant unit of measure used was "Cosi".
??"Things"?? Sort of like the American "whatsits", 27.3 of which make a thingamabob?
Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 2:03 am
by Aero
KitemanSA wrote:Betruger wrote: I can't recall the last time, if ever, that I saw Mg meaning million kg.
Never, I hope. Mg is 1000kg, not a million kg.
I read 1 Mg as one million grams. And yes, one million grams equals 1000 kg.
Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 6:11 am
by Giorgio
KitemanSA wrote:ladajo wrote:I found in my time in Italy that the most predominant unit of measure used was "Cosi".
??"Things"?? Sort of like the American "whatsits", 27.3 of which make a thingamabob?
It's Italian slang, you can translate it as "this much".
Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 10:01 am
by Betruger
KitemanSA wrote:Betruger wrote: I can't recall the last time, if ever, that I saw Mg meaning million kg.
Never, I hope. Mg is 1000kg, not a million kg.
Oops, that's what I meant.
krenshala wrote:Betruger wrote:Sure. But the point is that anytime you heard ton it was almost negligible chance it meant anything but 1000 kg. I can't recall the last time, if ever, that I saw Mg meaning million kg.
I don't mind it myself but it's not intuitive at first glance for probably most people.
Um ... you got that wrong.
Yes
I figured Mg would be pretty intuitive for anyone familiar with the metric system.
No it's not. "Familiar" isn't even close to how carved into our heads the metric system was by age 15. Almost no one has heard of hecto or decameters. Mg is at least that obscure. Stick it into a formal document out of the blue, without a discussion like the one we've had here, and it'll just come off as noise till people figure it out.
It just doesnt seem like a realistic idea unless it's done in major way, IE whatever org's in charge of nomenclature standards adopts it.
Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 11:54 am
by KitemanSA
Fine, then use "tonne" but leave "ton" to its meaning, 2000 pounds.
If you must SI, then SI dang it and leave us Imperialists alone!
Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 2:21 pm
by ladajo
Giorgio wrote:KitemanSA wrote:ladajo wrote:I found in my time in Italy that the most predominant unit of measure used was "Cosi".
??"Things"?? Sort of like the American "whatsits", 27.3 of which make a thingamabob?
It's Italian slang, you can translate it as "this much".
It is one of my favorite words. Extremely versatile and very much context driven in meaning.