Giant Thermoelectric Effect from Transmission Supernodes

[Giorgio]

Pretty interesting theoretical model.

http://uanews.org/node/34382
http://arxiv.org/PS_cache/arxiv/pdf/100 ... 2000v1.pdf

Looks like thermoelectric understanding is making some nice interesting leaps.

[rcain]

interesting post as always Gorgio,

i dont pretend to understand the detailed maths/physics involved here, but his closing remarks include:

Moreover, high-power macroscopic devices could be constructed by growing layers of densely packed molecules. For example, a self-assembled monolayer with a surface density16 of 4×1015molecules/cm2 would give 352kW/cm2 at peak efficiency for a meta-benzene film.

352kW/cm2 - (with ZT>=4) - sounds pretty impressive.

will be interesting to see what experimental work follows this.

[Giorgio]

What I really like of this work is the totally different path they choosed in pursuing the thermoelectric effect in respect to actual research.

Should their model hold during manufacturing we might see the first energetic revolution coming from an unexpected player (at least unexpected for me).

[qraal]

Forgive my ignorance of thermoelectric physics, but could a solid-state cryocooler be created using high ZT materials?

[rcain]

i think they are already - although i dont have any data, they appear not to be the most efficient cooling mechanism. sometimes used on space probes, etc, very low temp stuff in the lab is more often done with optical cooling. commercial TEC's (thermo electric coolers) are readily available, and cheap - try googling.

[Giorgio]

Forgive my ignorance of thermoelectric physics, but could a solid-state cryocooler be created using high ZT materials?

rcain already gave you quite a complete answer.
I can only add this nice comparison chart between different type of cooling devices and advantages/disadvantages of each:
http://www.eng.ox.ac.uk/cryogenics/spacecoolers.html

A google search on "thermoelectric cryocooler" is a good start to get a better grip on the subject if you are interested.

[TallDave]

Very interesting, thanks for sharing.

Another boost for thermal p-B11?

"We are the first to harness the wave nature of the electron and develop a concept to turn it into usable energy," Stafford said.
"Any quantum-scale device where you have a cancellation of electric charge will do the trick.."

That made me think of Johan. I wonder if there's any overlap with his theories here.

[Giorgio]

Not really an overlap, but a point of touch where they only consider the wave nature of the elctron.

It would be interesting for Johan to share his toughts on this. Yet it is still a theoretical model so some real data should be collected from a proof of principle proptotype before discussing this in details.

[icarus]

I speculate that Johan's thoughts would be "voodoo!".

It seems like the crux of the theory is very close to, if not actually based upon, Carver Mead's ideas of using electron wave function phase accumulation around a superconducting ring (in this case a benzene ring of a chain molecule).

[Giorgio]

Johan's bitterness in respect to the scientific world should be separated from his hypothesis.

I can understand his feeling toward scientific institutions, and I also believe that he should change attitude to be able to spread his thoughts better, yet his hypothesis is sound and has a supporter in me.

As for Carver Mead hypothesis, we can say is very close to it but I doubt it is based on it, otherwise they would have mentioned into the Arxiv paper.

[rcain]

It seems like the crux of the theory is very close to, if not actually based upon, Carver Mead's ideas of using electron wave function phase accumulation around a superconducting ring (in this case a benzene ring of a chain molecule).

that's a nice concise summary - thanks for that.

i havent read up on Carver Mead, but now i find him on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carver_Mead, i see some of his ideas are similar to those of John Cramer's Transactional model, which i am slightly more familiar with.

As Gorgio suggests its good to find 'alternative' models bearing up to the scrutiny of 'established' science. lets hope we hear more.

[Betruger]

Sounds like you missed this part of prior discussion, incl Dr Prins' response:
viewtopic.php?p=47231&highlight=carver+mead#47231

It starts a few posts before the above link.

[rcain]

thanks Betruger, I missed that thread, interesting. just read the 'An Interview with Carver Mead' - http://www.laputanlogic.com/articles/20 ... 36532.html -

A ten-foot electron! Amazing

made me chuckle.

[Giorgio]

So, I mailed Justin Bergfield to get some insight on when we might expect some actual experimental data or proof of concept prototype.

He was kind enough to reply to my e-mail:
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Dear Giorgio,

Thanks for you interest in our research! At the moment we are working with several different groups to fabricate our device. Of course it's difficult to put a time frame on progress, but there are experiments where people have reported measurements of the thermoelectric response of single molecular junctions; so there is hope that progress will be made quickly.

Cheers,
Justin
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They will be on my watchlist. I am eager to see any data that come from them.