Blue Origin did, their prototype 'Goddard' rocket is based on the DC-X design.
Goddard is only suborbital though and it is a two stage design now...
Of course if you look at suborbital there is a lot going on there, but that wont put a SBSP station into orbit.
I dont think any of the suborbital guys have plans to build an orbital DC-X in the future. Some might want to go orbital later, but with multi- stage designs.
Blue Origin did, their prototype 'Goddard' rocket is based on the DC-X design.
Goddard is only suborbital though and it is a two stage design now...
Of course if you look at suborbital there is a lot going on there, but that wont put a SBSP station into orbit.
I dont think any of the suborbital guys have plans to build an orbital DC-X in the future. Some might want to go orbital later, but with multi- stage designs.
Remember DC-X wasn't event sub-orbital , the DC-Y was to be orbital. What I remember Blue Origin salvaged DC-X parts and got some of the scientists who worked on it.
Oh, they are all looking at orbital flights, eventually. They just want to create a market and slowly progress to it, as the market leads.
If there was a light weight/powerful enough engine method to do SSO it would have been done by now. Just because the are doing two stages isn't a bad thing, when the technology is there, they could then switch.
Ram Accelerators
Estimated $600/kg
I've had some email correspondence with that research group, and I think the concept is sound. The problem is simply volume of cargo to get a reasonable return on investment, and a SSP program would solve that in an instant. Same with the launch loop, even if that would be a hell of an engineering project. Or the coilgun concept, though that needs fleshing out too.
Thin film solar cells can take the high launch forces, as can fuel, raw materials, and even any correctly modified commercial electronics (fill in the spaces with epoxy).
I have always believed that SPS could only realistically be sold on the merits of its (possible) secondary uses. It is possible that by tuning the frequency of the microwave energy emitted, you could use it to "steer" hurricanes or perhaps even break them up. Granted, you would likely have to do this very early on in the hurricanes life. The numbers that I have heard quoted necessary for hurricane control are well within the proposed output capabilities of even a small SPS platform. That would mean your SPS could save billions of dollars in damage a year and possibly thousands of lives. Much easier to sell even if you admit it may not work or that international considerations would prevent it from working (its got to go somewhere if you are steering it). The other interesting secondary use is as a terror weapon. The emitters discussed are designed specifically for wavelengths that cannot reasonably harm humans, but add a second emitter that it designed to kill (or just make people uncomfortable) or add a nice large laser and the DOD would be happy to help pay for it. It wouldn't be terribly survivable, but it could support a "star wars" defense system to protect itself. I mean, it would be out in geosynchronus orbit. Duck shoot for us and the russians, but probably unreachable for anyone else (the europeans are not going to agree to develop a weapon that only targets the US).
Whether or not you believe that either of these is practical or not, they both are sellable even with all the caviats. Heck, a space based weapon system like this would provide great cover for any other systems the DOD would like to put up there even if the original never works.
Just because it might be a boondoggle would not necessarily damage its credibility. Indeed it could help inside the beltway.
What is the difference between ignorance and apathy? I don't know and I don't care.
pfrit wrote:I have always believed that SPS could only realistically be sold on the merits of its (possible) secondary uses. It is possible that by tuning the frequency of the microwave energy emitted, you could use it to "steer" hurricanes or perhaps even break them up. Granted, you would likely have to do this very early on in the hurricanes life. The numbers that I have heard quoted necessary for hurricane control are well within the proposed output capabilities of even a small SPS platform.
Wikipedia wrote:Scientists at the US National Center for Atmospheric Research estimate that a tropical cyclone releases heat energy at the rate of 50 to 200 exajoules (1018 J) per day,[17] equivalent to about 1 PW (1015 watt). This rate of energy release is equivalent to 70 times the world energy consumption of humans and 200 times the worldwide electrical generating capacity,[17] or to exploding a 10-megaton nuclear bomb every 20 minutes.[23]
To steer a hurricane you only need to heat small patches of ocean around it. As I said, you would probably need to do it when the storm is young. Breaking up hurricanes always stuck me as difficult. I imagine if you could understanding the system well enough, you could use the proverbial butterfly in China to break it up. I believe that a very small amount of energy applied in a sufficiently clever way could break up. I do not believe we have that level of info to do it now. I am willing to imagine that we could do it with sufficient study. I am not going to bet on it, but there you go. More likely would be the possibility of preventing the eye wall forming in the first place. More likely, but still tricky. All of this is, however, moot. As I said, this is just a selling point. It may lead to some mediation of the storms frequency or intensity, but I wouldn't bet on it. It is more likely to work then oil spills or icebergs, and probably the most likely way for it to work at all. Being the most likely method of something that is not likely to start with... Again, just a way of selling to congress and the public.
What is the difference between ignorance and apathy? I don't know and I don't care.
That's all interesting, but who pays out on the law suits? If you had just left the track of the hurricane alone, it would have missed my house, but because you messed with the track, I need a million dollars to repair my house, and $100 million in punitive damages. We'll make this a class action law suit, and sue everyone from the controller/operator to the wise guy who had the first idea. And I don't care where it would have otherwise came ashore, you damaged my property and I want mine ...
Aero wrote: That's all interesting, but who pays out on the law suits? If you had just left the track of the hurricane alone, it would have missed my house, but because you messed with the track, I need a million dollars to repair my house, and $100 million in punitive damages. We'll make this a class action law suit, and sue everyone from the controller/operator to the wise guy who had the first idea. And I don't care where it would have otherwise came ashore, you damaged my property and I want mine ...
As I said...
pfrit wrote: Much easier to sell even if you admit it may not work or that international considerations would prevent it from working (its got to go somewhere if you are steering it).
Please understand that I am not saying that this would be practical. Just easier to sell.
I am stunned that everyone went after the hurricane idea (which is at least worth looking at on the small scale) and ignored the simple fact that any SPS is a hidden "Super" weapon that at the very least can splash every plane in the air over one half of the earth in less than an hour (reasonably, less than 10 minutes). Kill everyone outside in a city in 10 minutes. Fry everyone in a crowd of protesters in seconds (OK, that would be tricky with microwaves, but could be done). Vaporize the President of Venezuela while he leaves his car. But of course we, the US government, wouldn't put that stove sized package on that square mile satelite. How could you ever hide it? We can trust the CIA. And I am sure that Hugo and Raoul (Chavez and Castro) would trust the CIA as well. I mean, they would have to once it was in orbit.
What is the difference between ignorance and apathy? I don't know and I don't care.
Aero wrote: That's all interesting, but who pays out on the law suits? If you had just left the track of the hurricane alone, it would have missed my house, but because you messed with the track, I need a million dollars to repair my house, and $100 million in punitive damages. We'll make this a class action law suit, and sue everyone from the controller/operator to the wise guy who had the first idea. And I don't care where it would have otherwise came ashore, you damaged my property and I want mine ...
As I said...
pfrit wrote: Much easier to sell even if you admit it may not work or that international considerations would prevent it from working (its got to go somewhere if you are steering it).
Please understand that I am not saying that this would be practical. Just easier to sell.
I am stunned that everyone went after the hurricane idea (which is at least worth looking at on the small scale) and ignored the simple fact that any SPS is a hidden "Super" weapon that at the very least can splash every plane in the air over one half of the earth in less than an hour (reasonably, less than 10 minutes). Kill everyone outside in a city in 10 minutes. Fry everyone in a crowd of protesters in seconds (OK, that would be tricky with microwaves, but could be done). Vaporize the President of Venezuela while he leaves his car. But of course we, the US government, wouldn't put that stove sized package on that square mile satelite. How could you ever hide it? We can trust the CIA. And I am sure that Hugo and Raoul (Chavez and Castro) would trust the CIA as well. I mean, they would have to once it was in orbit.
I'd be much more interested in a device that can make Cajun Fried Hugo Chavez than one that causes droughts in Oklahoma.
As much as people hate weather and natural disasters, the weather is the great democrat: it is an equal opportunity destroyer, you cant blame anybody for it (though the AGW types are trying their best to do so). The moment you start messing with the weather, you will create drama, strife, and resentment. international class warfare.
That kind of thing worried me until I realized that they can already do those things. Not easily, but just as effectively and with fewer people knowing.
"There was a huge power drop from SPS01, and a crowd of protestors suddenly burst into flame."
is a bit more obvious than,
"A crazed protestor caused a tragedy in downtown somewheresville, letting off a homemade pipe bomb in the middle of a crowd"
Unless the CIA was going in for a reign of terror, in which case it would work just dandy. But I don't think that even the CIA could get away with that.